Author Topic: Tutu or BGT  (Read 17465 times)

Offline Lunever

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Tutu or BGT
« on: March 22, 2009, 06:06:09 PM »
I would like to play good old Baldur's Gate once more, this time with the BG2 engine.
Before I actually start playing the Tutu I just installed, I wonder - there is Tutu and there is BGT. Which one should I use, or what are each ones advantages/disadvantages?
Does it make any sense to have both? If so, can they share ressources or would that require all files and disk space to be there twice?
Is there a reliable way to include Icewind Dale too?

Currently installed:

Tutu+BG2 (with TosC+ToB), space-saving installation, latest patch, latest beta patch (installed after Tutu),
degreenfilter, tutufix, npckits, spawnrandomizer, g3-bg2fix, g3-bg2tweak.
Godlike (from before installing the tweakpack), Shadowkeeper

IWD1+2 with latest patches, iwd1-tweaks, dalekeeper (not working anymore after I installed the iwd1tweaks).
NWN1+SoU+HotU+bioware's premium modules+latest patch.

WeiDU and DLCTEP though I'm not sure how to use them properly and whether I configured them correctly.
« Last Edit: March 22, 2009, 06:09:39 PM by Lunever »

Offline Jarno Mikkola

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Re: Tutu or BGT
« Reply #1 on: March 24, 2009, 09:51:32 AM »
I would like to play good old Baldur's Gate once more, this time with the BG2 engine. Before I actually start playing the Tutu I just installed, I wonder - there is Tutu and there is BGT. Which one should I use, or what are each ones advantages/disadvantages? Does it make any sense to have both? If so, can they share resources or would that require all files and disk space to be there twice?
Is there a reliable way to include Icewind Dale too?
There is actually 2 different Tutu mods, there is the BG1Tutu(v4) and the EasyTutu... also I would like to say that you should never install the latest beta patch, it could brake your whole computers processing capability, as it contains ancient directX patches, and nothing up to date usable.

Now, it's your preference which(BGT or the Tutus) you wish to use, but in my opinion, I did a good comparison in here. And no, I didn't give a straight answer, cause there isn't one, as the answer depends: How long are you going to play it, how many times, nd what other mods are you going to include, and do you want to have the 1 final mod that's made just for Tutu.
Yes, there was few questions in the link I left unanswered, but as you said, "Nevermind"... :P

Now, what goes to the programs sharing resources, they don't, but they can be copied from one to another, usually. So, the mods need to be installed to the game engine installation folder, meaning the place where they have a dialog.tlk and BGMain.exe or IDMain.exe. They all have the override folder, that is used to store the games modified files, and this is the place where the mod usually bring their modified files, so the game can use them.

WeiDU and DLCTEP though I'm not sure how to use them properly and whether I configured them correctly.
Well the WeiDU.exe in principle is just a renamed installation executable that runs the setup-*modname*.tp2's commands. So it doesn't need to be configured. Yes the setup-*modname*.exe is the same weiDU.exe if their versions are the same. And this is what the installation process always tries to make sure of, that all the exes are auto-updated to the latest version.
On the DLCTEP, you do have the .dat files from here(the link at the bottom of the page in the link will make you to download the .dat files, so you can actually setup the program right), as they are needed.

Offline razlyubleno

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Re: Tutu or BGT
« Reply #2 on: March 24, 2009, 12:20:33 PM »
Does it make any sense to have both?
Not in the least.

If so, can they share ressources or would that require all files and disk space to be there twice?
It would require duplication of resources.

Is there a reliable way to include Icewind Dale too?
There is a stalled project that aims to do this, but it's unlikely to be finished any time soon.

[...] latest patch, latest beta patch (installed after Tutu),
Don't install the patch after Tutu. Install it immediately after ToB has been installed. The rule of thumb for patches, is to install them as early on as possible. This goes for all games.

dalekeeper (not working anymore after I installed the iwd1tweaks).
Try NearInfinity. It's a little harder to use, but it should work for your purposes: http://www.idi.ntnu.no/~joh/ni/download.html

[...] DLCTEP [...]
This is a full-featured resource editor. You most likely don't need it.

Offline DavidW

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Re: Tutu or BGT
« Reply #3 on: March 24, 2009, 12:48:41 PM »
Is there a reliable way to include Icewind Dale too?
There is a stalled project that aims to do this, but it's unlikely to be finished any time soon.

Care to place a small wager?

Offline razlyubleno

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Re: Tutu or BGT
« Reply #4 on: March 24, 2009, 12:53:29 PM »
Care to place a small wager?
You are surely pulling my leg. And getting my hopes up. And being all kinds of other nastiness. What secret infos have you, David?

Offline DavidW

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Re: Tutu or BGT
« Reply #5 on: March 24, 2009, 01:20:13 PM »
Care to place a small wager?
You are surely pulling my leg. And getting my hopes up. And being all kinds of other nastiness. What secret infos have you, David?
Only a working beta.

Offline razlyubleno

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Re: Tutu or BGT
« Reply #6 on: March 24, 2009, 01:35:48 PM »
Only a working beta.
Experience suggests we'll have a broken gamma soon... :)

Offline Lunever

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Re: Tutu or BGT
« Reply #7 on: March 26, 2009, 09:20:44 AM »
Well, thanks for the support.
For now I'll try playing through EasyTutu, and maybe I'll later have a look at BGT. And when I'm through with it, maybe we'll even have an unbroken dale gamma ;-)

Offline Lunever

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Re: Tutu or BGT
« Reply #8 on: March 26, 2009, 09:24:09 AM »
PS: I've installed NPC-Kits for EasyTutu and the tweak BG1 weapon proficiencies with BG2 combat styles, not sure anymore in which order.
Now even in new games some NPCs have nonsensical stats, like "spear" for Montaron, who can't use spears, or "unused" for Khalid (fighter/mage variant). Aside from editing savegames with dalekeeper, is there a way to edit the default NPCs so at least new games will start without nonsensical stats?

Offline razlyubleno

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Re: Tutu or BGT
« Reply #9 on: March 26, 2009, 09:34:30 AM »
Aside from editing savegames with dalekeeper, is there a way to edit the default NPCs so at least new games will start without nonsensical stats?
Try Level 1 NPCs. That might be the easiest way.

Offline Lunever

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Re: Tutu or BGT
« Reply #10 on: March 26, 2009, 10:03:44 AM »
Yes, but it specifically says that you shoudn't install it after the tweak.
Is it possible by for example using shadowkeeper to manually edit the default NPCs?
It seems that I can access the NPCs via the "edit cre file" option, but which files should I edit? There seem to be several ones for each character.

Offline razlyubleno

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Re: Tutu or BGT
« Reply #11 on: March 26, 2009, 10:18:39 AM »
Sorry, sometimes I sleepwalk through my responses.

There are multiple versions of each NPCs creature file. The numbers next to their name tell you what level they are in that version, that's the only real difference. If you can figure out which level you're likely to meet them at, you can edit the right file with NearInfinity or whatever. Otherwise you can use ShadowKeeper to edit the NPC once they are in your party, which is probably what you want to do.

Offline Lunever

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Re: Tutu or BGT
« Reply #12 on: March 26, 2009, 03:50:35 PM »
Nah, editing savegames with shadowkeeper is pretty easy, but I would like this to be unecessary in the first place.
So I gather if I just check all of a character's files of all possible levels for wrong proficiencies and fix them this bug shouldn't reoccur.

Offline razlyubleno

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Re: Tutu or BGT
« Reply #13 on: March 27, 2009, 03:09:52 AM »
So I gather if I just check all of a character's files of all possible levels for wrong proficiencies and fix them this bug shouldn't reoccur.
True. Just make sure to change the BG2 proficiencies, not the BG1 ones. In BG1 the proficiencies are controlled by the proficiency fields in the creature file. In BG2 they are handled by attached effects, using opcode 233. You'll see what I mean when you open the file in NearInfinity.

Offline Lunever

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Re: Tutu or BGT
« Reply #14 on: March 27, 2009, 06:59:18 AM »
Well, if I use shadowkeeper to open CRE files, select some for Montaron like _Mont.cre, _Mont2.cre, _Mont4.cre, _Mont6.cre, delete the wrong proficiency (i.e. spear) and add a substitute one (i.e. missile weapons), will that work? For the files may origonally be from BG1, but in Tutu they would be handled by BG2 and shadowkeeper is a BG2 editor and I supose that means it already handles stuff BG2-like?

Offline razlyubleno

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Re: Tutu or BGT
« Reply #15 on: March 27, 2009, 12:22:02 PM »
For the files may origonally be from BG1, but in Tutu they would be handled by BG2 and shadowkeeper is a BG2 editor and I supose that means it already handles stuff BG2-like?
Exactly. Tutu converts the creature files to use BG2-style proficiencies, and ShadowKeeper sets proficiencies in the way the BG2 engine wants them.

razly

Offline Lunever

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Re: Tutu or BGT
« Reply #16 on: March 27, 2009, 01:28:29 PM »
Now, here's another one, probably more difficult:

In original BG1 it was easy to dismiss NPC pairs separately. All you had to do was putting them in separate mapped rooms of some building like the friendly arms and then dismiss one of them. Now Tutu doesn't seem to allow this. If I want for example just Jaheira and not Khalid I can try to dismiss him. Sometimes Khalid says some parting words and then both leave, even if in different map rooms of the friendly arms. Sometimes he just leaves without dialogue, and I can keep Jaheira. If I dismiss Jaheira, she always just leaves without a word and leaves Khalid in the party.

If I successfully dismiss him and keep her, he always goes forever. I would like to somehow force the game to dismiss him like you dismiss a happy NPC who will wait for you to recruit him again. Does anybody have an idea how to do so? (If I CreateCreature Khalid he stays running away and disappearing, even if I just ctrl-Yed him instead of dismissing him). There are some global variables "_Khalid" and "_Jaheira", but I couldn't make out, what they are doing.

Offline Jarno Mikkola

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Re: Tutu or BGT
« Reply #17 on: March 27, 2009, 02:52:47 PM »
Does anybody have an idea how to do so?
Well, one way to do so is to put the item called 'scrl16' to the NPCs you wish to dismiss quick item slot and then use it. He/she will never going to bother you again, cause the stone statues have their... :)
« Last Edit: March 27, 2009, 02:55:54 PM by Jarno Mikkola »

Offline DavidW

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Re: Tutu or BGT
« Reply #18 on: March 28, 2009, 02:53:07 AM »
Now, here's another one, probably more difficult:

In original BG1 it was easy to dismiss NPC pairs separately. All you had to do was putting them in separate mapped rooms of some building like the friendly arms and then dismiss one of them. Now Tutu doesn't seem to allow this. If I want for example just Jaheira and not Khalid I can try to dismiss him. Sometimes Khalid says some parting words and then both leave, even if in different map rooms of the friendly arms. Sometimes he just leaves without dialogue, and I can keep Jaheira. If I dismiss Jaheira, she always just leaves without a word and leaves Khalid in the party.

If I successfully dismiss him and keep her, he always goes forever. I would like to somehow force the game to dismiss him like you dismiss a happy NPC who will wait for you to recruit him again. Does anybody have an idea how to do so?

Install Sword Coast Stratagems (www.gibberlings3net/scs), which has a component to do precisely this.

Offline Lunever

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Re: Tutu or BGT
« Reply #19 on: March 28, 2009, 03:16:36 AM »
Hey, thanks! Seems to be exactly what I was looking for. I hope I can just install it after the Tweakpack?

Offline razlyubleno

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Re: Tutu or BGT
« Reply #20 on: March 28, 2009, 04:09:16 AM »
I hope I can just install it after the Tweakpack?
Yes, you can.

razly

Offline Lunever

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Re: Tutu or BGT
« Reply #21 on: March 28, 2009, 06:57:49 AM »
Right - it does work, but unfortunately only for new games.
Any idea how to alter the leaving state from a current game if I don't want to start all over again?

 

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