Weapon Creation Question

[Kanain]

I'm curious -- is it possible to create a weapon that is useable only by <charname>?  I am familiar enough with DLTCEP to create regular items, but I do not know how to accomplish this goal, or even if it is possible.  I've examined Yoshimo and Keldorn's weapons to see what makes them exclusive to them and I can't see what it is.  Anyway any insight that could be provided would be appreciated.....

Thanks,
Brian

<Edit fixed word omission>

[jcompton]

There have been various attempts at this, mostly revolving around assigning scripts that say "If anybody but Player1 has this item, take it away." They've met with mixed success. I don't know, offhand, what the "best" approach to the problem is, just that we didn't find a good one years ago while working on Kelsey.

[Kanain]

There have been various attempts at this, mostly revolving around assigning scripts that say "If anybody but Player1 has this item, take it away." They've met with mixed success. I don't know, offhand, what the "best" approach to the problem is, just that we didn't find a good one years ago while working on Kelsey.

I was hoping there would be a better way than scripting.  I suppose I will see what I can do there.  Thanks!

B

[Lu]

I'm curious -- is it possible to create a weapon that is useable only by <charname>?

   I wonder if in the future - very, very distant future, when they have this gemRB project finished, such questions will be asked in the Beginner's Guide to IE, kinda homework
   Or has gemRB nothing to do with this stuff?

[CoM_Solaufein]

Make it so it matches their alignment, class and race. There should be check boxes for that.

[Ghreyfain]

Make it so it matches their alignment, class and race. There should be check boxes for that.

<CHARNAME>.

[Wounded_Lion]

Melkor was probably referring to NPC-specific weapons.  For NPCs, I would tailor the weapon to the character's race, alignment, class, & stats (unless someone knows of a better way?).  For <CHARNAME>, I have no ideas except for scripting.

a W.L.

[Ghreyfain]

Yes, obviously.  Kanain even mentioned that he'd checked out Keldorn's and Yoshimo's weapons, so he knows how it's done for NPCs.  Player1, though, is going to involve scripting as you say, which will mean it'll suck, and be prone to breakage.

[CoM_Solaufein]

Melkor was probably referring to NPC-specific weapons.  For NPCs, I would tailor the weapon to the character's race, alignment, class, & stats (unless someone knows of a better way?).  For <CHARNAME>, I have no ideas except for scripting.

a W.L.

Quite right. Guess that wasn't the question. I'll have to be helpful when it's not close for me to go to bed.

[Zyraen]

I remember Igi once came up with effects to automatically upgrade a weapon on certain conditions being met, or something like that, without using any scripts or dialogues.

I can't remember exactly where the tutorial is, but if you take a route similar to that and provide conditional checks such that
IF
Player2-6 is holding/equipped with the item
THEN
item to be dropped (or destroyed and a copy placed in the inventory)

If you can do that, then I think you would have semi-succeeded in your objective of making it Player1 specific without scripts.

[Lu]

Kanain even mentioned that he'd checked out Keldorn's and Yoshimo's weapons, so he knows how it's done for NPCs

  You know the answer, right? I once did exactly the same check, so I know how they did it
   Before that, I was sure it was REAL hardcode, e.g. usability targets Death Variable. That would be cool, I guess

[Kanain]

Yes, obviously.  Kanain even mentioned that he'd checked out Keldorn's and Yoshimo's weapons, so he knows how it's done for NPCs. 

Actually, I took a look at them in DLTCEP but couldn't determine how they did it.  The only common thing between the two is that they both have 3 entries under equipping effects for "Colour: Set Character colours by Palette".  I have no idea how that has anything to do with it, so actually I can't determine how they did for the NPCs either.

[Lu]

   Hint: check usability with DLTCEP
   Feel free to ask if I've not answered yet, of course

[Kanain]

   Hint: check usability with DLTCEP
   Feel free to ask if I've not answered yet, of course

Yeah I checked the usability tab to begin with once upon a time.  I don't see anything in there that would, under all circumstances, exclude those weapons from a potential <charname>.  What is it?

[Lu]

Yeah I checked the usability tab to begin with once upon a time.  I don't see anything in there that would, under all circumstances, exclude those weapons from a potential <charname>.  What is it?

   If Charname's stats, race, class, etc meet the requirements, then alas, Charname can use weapon, e.g.

  Usable Only By:
  Yosimo

  as the description says

[Kanain]

   If Charname's stats, race, class, etc meet the requirements, then alas, Charname can use weapon, e.g.

  Usable Only By:
  Yosimo

  as the description says

Surely you're jesting with me, but unfortunatley doing a fly by.  Are you saying that it is the weapon's description which tells the engine that only Yoshimo can use it?  I don't think that's the case.

[Drew]

Any bounty hunter thief that meets the minimum stats the weapon calls for can use it.  For all reasonable intents and purposes, only Yoshimo can use the weapon since your PC is unlikely to be a bounty hunter, and even if he is, one of the stats the sword checks for may be lower than Yoshimo's.  (making the weapon unuseable)

[Kanain]

Any bounty hunter thief that meets the minimum stats the weapon calls for can use it.  For all reasonable intents and purposes, only Yoshimo can use the weapon since your PC is unlikely to be a bounty hunter, and even if he is, one of the stats the sword checks for may be lower than Yoshimo's.  (making the weapon unuseable)

Actually the weapon isn't restricted to just bounty hunters.  Several other classes who are able to use Katanas are actually checked to have access to the weapon as well.  Any ...neutral or neutral... who is human or half orc of those classes should be able to use it.  I don't recall my neutral good human figher to be able to use it, however.  I could be wrong.  I'm logged into my machine from work right now so I can't test this, but I will when I get home.

[Lu]

Are you saying that it is the weapon's description which tells the engine that only Yoshimo can use it?  I don't think that's the case

   I only meant to make clearer what I referred. And an item description actually is crap, sometimes it's even incorrect (not often though), anyway it doesn't affect anything, sure enough, the engine doesn't care at all what it says. Sorry if it's still not 100% clear. I'm a bit upset now

  OK, I'll try it again. The description says 'Only usable by Yoshimo', but actually anyone of the proper race, class, and whatever it says in the fields of the .ITM file that determine the item usability can use it

[Kanain]

I only meant to make clearer what I referred. And an item description actually is crap, sometimes it's even incorrect (not often though), anyway it doesn't affect anything, sure enough, the engine doesn't care at all what it says. Sorry if it's still not 100% clear. I'm a bit upset now

Yeah I understood what you were saying when I read what Drew posted.  I don't understand why the powers that be would declare that a weapon is only usable by "Insert NPC name here" when that is not the case.  What's the point of bothering to declare such a thing, then?

[Lu]

powers that be would declare

I am sorry... "be would declare"?
  Anyway, the description is only for you to read it, that's it. Kinda "don't even think of giving it to anyone else, it's for Yoshi only"

[Kanain]

powers that be would declare

I am sorry... "be would declare"?
  Anyway, the description is only for you to read it, that's it. Kinda "don't even think of giving it to anyone else, it's for Yoshi only"

"The powers that be" = the writers of the game.  I'm saying that I don't understand why they would declare that the weapon was usable only by a certain NPC when that statement was not true within the game world.  That doesn't make sense.  If they couldn't actually accomplish that, then I question the point of including such things as a part of the game to begin with.  I have tried to wield all of the NPC "exclusive" weapons and I don't recall ever being able to do so, even when my PC matched all the usability selections as seen in DLTCEP.  Like I said to Drew, I could be wrong on that, though.  I simply don't recall ever being able to.

Edit to replace "could" with "would'

[Lu]

@Kanain
 Start DLTCEP. Open any of Yoshi's .CRE files, change Death Variable, dialog, scripts, whatever. Save as new .CRE (use whatever file name you like, but not any of Yoshi's). Find a way to summon a creature who's .CRE file we have now. Have him/her join your party (Yoshi is already in the party). Give Yoshi's sword to the new guy/chick. See the result

[Kanain]

@Lu:

Don't get me wrong -- I'm not saying you're wrong or that I don't believe you.  I am dubious, yes, this much is true.  However, right now I'm simply stating that I think the Devs are silly for doing such a thing if this is indeed the case.  I am going to investigate it further when I get home from work this morning....

[Lu]

I am going to investigate it further when I get home from work this morning

   And that's what I expect you to do actually. I hope you'll let us know of the results