Author Topic: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!  (Read 20912 times)

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Re: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!
« Reply #75 on: October 12, 2005, 06:37:10 PM »
Provide us with proof that Seifer and Shed's actions were at the command of SConrad, and I'll accept that you're correct.

EDIT: Actually, I'll also need proof that SConrad has broken ShS' own rules.  After all, to be a dictator, a person must believe that the law does not apply to him.

EDIT 2: Oh, and you'll also need to prove that ShS staff never do anything which SConrad disapproves of.  A person can't be a dictator if his minions are getting up to things he doesn't want them to.  This will need to be extremely strong proof, since there's already plenty of proof that ShS staff *have* done things SCronad disapproves of (myself included).
Prove ptherwise. Actions speak louder than words.

Oh yes another thing. You really should regain your compulsure, it's starting to slip. Come to think of it, so is your grip on reality.  :D

Offline NiGHTMARE

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Re: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!
« Reply #76 on: October 12, 2005, 06:40:00 PM »
In the civilized world, we have this little thing called "innocent until proven guility".  Given your apparent hatred of totalitarian regimes, logic suggests you should believe in this concept quite strongly. You made an accusation, so I'm afraid the requirement of proof is therefore your burden, not mine.

EDIT: Incidentally, is it just me or are there a suspiciously large number of "guests" posting in this thread? Not that *I'm* making any accusations or anything...
« Last Edit: October 12, 2005, 06:45:27 PM by NiGHTMARE »
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Ding0

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Re: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!
« Reply #77 on: October 12, 2005, 06:47:14 PM »
All my postings have been as Ding0. (I have to type it in explicitly each time which is hugely annoying.) The network here doesn't like cookies.

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Re: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!
« Reply #78 on: October 12, 2005, 07:02:17 PM »

EDIT: Incidentally, is it just me or are there a suspiciously large number of "guests" posting in this thread? Not that *I'm* making any accusations or anything...
Of course, we wouldn't dream of *you* making accusations.  :)

Offline NiGHTMARE

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Re: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!
« Reply #79 on: October 12, 2005, 07:12:37 PM »
If a mod's released to the public, I'd say "people dislike it" is a pretty compelling reason for the author to reconsider his or her stance on it. (This is where you try the "you should mod for your own satisfaction" argument again, but consider once more my earlier assertion that joke mods are clearly intended to provke a response from the player.)

If the mod were entirely created for the benefit of other people, it would need to be definitively established that the majority of players don't want this kind of mod, but I've yet to see any evidence of this... though I'm entirely open to being proved wrong.  If the mod were created with other people being only of secondary concern, even a handful of other people liking it would still be a bonus.

Quote
Even setting that aside, "lack of staying power" is clearly a proposed characteristic of the type of mod rather than my personal opinion on anything particular.

Err, that was kind of my point :).  It's an objective fact (based on past occurences) that a non- or semi-interactive joke mod is going to have less replay value than an interactive serious mod, and I'd suspect that the mod's authors have already recognized and accepted this fact; having it pointed out to them by a third party seems somewhat superflous, especially *after* the mod has been released.  If someone really feels that a mod's authors don't recognize that people will only ever use their creation once and then delete it forever, and that this is an important issue, wouldn't it be better to point it out to the authors as early as possible, rather than after their mod has already been completed?

Quote
And similarly, if I make a post that you feel is useless, it seems resaonable to assume that I either feel it is useful, or I don't mind if it's not. I'll play my "same difference" card again to this one. Really, you're going to have to back down on one of these issues. :)

Not quite the same.  After all, while many people mod for themselves, I'm not sure there are too many people who write posts purely for their own personal benefit, especially not ones which attempt to influence other peoples' opinions.  If I create something with other people in mind, I'm going to more influenced by those peoples' opinions than I would for something I make mainly for myself, so I'm going to be more receptive to comments on my posting habits than comments on my modding habits.

If you initially believe your post's audience is open to having their opinion regarding something changed (i.e. that SConrad, Shed and co. can be persuaded that joke mods are a waste of their time), but you're later persuaded that your audience are not going to change their opinion in the matter, I'd hope you would re-evaluate the usefulness of your post.  And I'm guessing you do care whether your attempts to persuade other people to revise their opinions are successful or not, else I can't see there being much point in your doing so :).
« Last Edit: October 12, 2005, 07:38:58 PM by NiGHTMARE »
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foo

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Re: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!
« Reply #80 on: October 12, 2005, 07:36:25 PM »
Maybe TheWizard will offer to host it?

Offline Shed

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Re: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!
« Reply #81 on: October 12, 2005, 08:09:35 PM »
Quote
Maybe TheWizard will offer to host it?
The Jerry Zinger Show is already on TW's sites. Or are you referring to the "Hip Hop Mod", that well known not-worthless, not-awful (bad, imo, but you don't see me complaining) joke mod?

What isn't obvious is why - if SConrad's and my time is so important to Ding0 - he didn't forewarn us of the terrible consequences* that would befall us from making the mod. It was started quite some time ago, but we get this whining only when it's released.  Also I wonder why, now the 'damage' is done, he seeks to waste more of his own and my time by bothering me here and elsewhere about my business, namely what I do, when I do it and who for whose benefit. Whatever his motives, there seems to be no suggestion that they are sincere.

By the way, is anyone counting what percentage of the day's posts discuss a mod made elsewhere? I also find it amusing.

Shouldn't personal insults be at least noticed by a moderator around here? Is it ok to call respectable modders "idiots, tyrants, henchmen, high, insane, fascists" and God only knows what else?

*One released mod.
« Last Edit: October 12, 2005, 08:11:08 PM by Shed »
Quote from: jcompton
Whatever, man. We'll just see what happens when Seifer and Shed have another attack of "omg we are teh funy".

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Re: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!
« Reply #82 on: October 12, 2005, 08:14:37 PM »
Shouldn't personal insults be at least noticed by a moderator around here? Is it ok to call respectable modders "idiots, tyrants, henchmen, high, insane, fascists" and God only knows what else?

*One released mod.
Who said they are respectable? That you and they are not. Go back to that hole you call SHS.

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Re: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!
« Reply #83 on: October 12, 2005, 08:18:35 PM »
I forgot! You want that dictorual action taken here. Sucks when you don't have the power to edit/delete others posts.  :D

Offline Ghreyfain

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Re: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!
« Reply #84 on: October 12, 2005, 08:28:22 PM »
And here I was all happy that things had been resolved in Bons' post.

People have voiced their opinion against the mod.  That's allowed.
People have voiced their opinions that voicing negative opinions shouldn't be allowed.  Well, I guess that's allowed, too.
People have voiced their opinion that voicing an opinion against voicing an opinion is opinionated hypocrisy.  That's confusing, but... allowed.
People... my god, you're making fools of yourselves.  I'm enjoying it immensely.  Carry on.

Now, as for my contribution to the foolishness, I would ask NiGHTMARE to definitively post his opinion on whether negative criticism is an acceptable thing to do or not, without any mincing, dancing, prancing, gallivanting, semanticising, or other shenanigans.
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Offline Dark Raven

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Re: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!
« Reply #85 on: October 12, 2005, 08:30:51 PM »
 :D  Feel the love.  :D
Per me si va nella citta dolente.
Per me si va nell eterno dolore.
Per me si va tra la perduta gente...
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Offline Ghreyfain

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Re: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!
« Reply #86 on: October 12, 2005, 08:34:31 PM »
You.  You ruined the last one, so don't go crazy in this one, please.
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Offline Dark Raven

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Re: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!
« Reply #87 on: October 12, 2005, 08:35:56 PM »
You. You ruined the last one, so don't go crazy in this one, please.
Who me?  Certainly not I. :D
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Offline Shed

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Re: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!
« Reply #88 on: October 12, 2005, 08:36:49 PM »
For anyone who remembers what the topic was all about, you can find out more about the Jerry Zinger Show here. Thanks for the publicity, guys ;).
Quote from: jcompton
Whatever, man. We'll just see what happens when Seifer and Shed have another attack of "omg we are teh funy".

Offline Dark Raven

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Re: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!
« Reply #89 on: October 12, 2005, 08:48:34 PM »
Cheers!  :D
« Last Edit: October 12, 2005, 09:00:48 PM by Blood Raven »
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Offline Loriel

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Re: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!
« Reply #90 on: October 12, 2005, 09:45:24 PM »
For anyone who remembers what the topic was all about, you can find out more about the Jerry Zinger Show here. Thanks for the publicity, guys ;).

I've been checking in every few minutes to see what new entertainment this thread would bring...kinda like the Jerry Springer, er...Zinger show. ::)  Normally I would get involved, but sometimes it's just fun to watch people beating each other with wet noodles.  I'll agree with Ghrey - by all means carry on.  Maybe someone will reveal that they're sleeping with a moderator from the other modding community or something.  I think this really is good publicity for the mod in question.

Offline Ghreyfain

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Re: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!
« Reply #91 on: October 12, 2005, 10:15:02 PM »
Studios doesn't have any hot chicks that I'm aware of.
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Offline jcompton

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Re: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!
« Reply #92 on: October 12, 2005, 11:47:10 PM »
By the way, is anyone counting what percentage of the day's posts discuss a mod made elsewhere? I also find it amusing.

Shouldn't personal insults be at least noticed by a moderator around here? Is it ok to call respectable modders "idiots, tyrants, henchmen, high, insane, fascists" and God only knows what else?

Well. Seeing as how the free, unfiltered discussion of this mod isn't permitted at Studios, I guess I can't say I'm too surprised to see it getting more airtime here.

And, if it makes you feel better: yes, I noticed. Are you implying that you prefer it when disreputable modders are insulted?
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Offline Salk

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Re: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!
« Reply #93 on: October 12, 2005, 11:59:07 PM »
Being italian I come with a latin motto:

"De gustibus non disputandum est" which means each personal taste has a reason for existing and we shouldn't really feel the need to understand them. Instead sometimes we try and reason in order to let something fit in our logic. But it's not always possible.

I am on Andyr's side about this. Criticism should always be welcome but a person should also know how to make a constructive critic. Using some politeness would have the Modders receive the criticism with a completely different spirit and would actually prove to be more effective.

SimDing0 is also partly right when he says that one does not need to experience a Mod when its pretty evident what the content might be about but, and here we disagree, I believe that a criticism should come only from those who actaully played the specific Mod because otherwise we should just be speaking in general (which was not really the case here).

Personally I won't play Jerry Zinger because I am a bit too "serious" D&D player and I think space for "humor" in the Baldur's Gate saga should be kept really down and concentrated perhaps in some hilarious but pretty subtle situations but I can't say Jerry Zinger is a bad Mod. I might think it's, as personal taste, a "bad concept" to start with but this is all another thing...

I respect all Modders that work hard and provide us new ways of entertainment. Of course not all Mods (there are so many out there, thanks!  :P) can have the same targets in the Community.

Also, it'd feel nice to have some "guest" posts (highly offensive and pretty stupid) removed from the thread as I don't think leaving them is a good publicity for PPG. Just my 2 cents, here...

Technically speaking, Jerry Zinger might be wonderful. Wouldn't this be already a good reason to produce it ?  :pirate
« Last Edit: October 13, 2005, 12:01:35 AM by Salk »

Offline Borsook

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Re: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!
« Reply #94 on: October 13, 2005, 03:13:11 AM »
After all, to be a dictator, a person must believe that the law does not apply to him.
Ehm. No. At least not in a proper meaning of a word, a Dictator is given very special priviligies and duties, but the extend of that is governed by law, of course a dictator may feel himself above law as well as a e.g. mayor but in no way is it a prerequirement. :)

PS. Guys what's with the all guest posting?
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Offline Borsook

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Re: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!
« Reply #95 on: October 13, 2005, 03:14:58 AM »
All my postings have been as Ding0. (I have to type it in explicitly each time which is hugely annoying.) The network here doesn't like cookies.
Use copy/paste Sim ;D
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Offline Exodus

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Re: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!
« Reply #96 on: October 13, 2005, 03:54:38 AM »
By the way, is anyone counting what percentage of the day's posts discuss a mod made elsewhere? I also find it amusing.

Shouldn't personal insults be at least noticed by a moderator around here? Is it ok to call respectable modders "idiots, tyrants, henchmen, high, insane, fascists" and God only knows what else?

Well. Seeing as how the free, unfiltered discussion of this mod isn't permitted at Studios, I guess I can't say I'm too surprised to see it getting more airtime here.

And, if it makes you feel better: yes, I noticed. Are you implying that you prefer it when disreputable modders are insulted?

Mod discussion is fine, slagging it off and calling the creators/hosters "fascists" etc is a different kettle of fish though JC.  If your idea of a free and open discsussion on a self confessed bit of fun involves the above then I'd rather keep an eye on it thanks.

And why (ad infinitum) can't we just agree to disagree?  We've all said our bit, had some fair commentary, the typical guest bitching and so forth.  Although the dictator analogy is entertaining I can't see any justification for turning a simple mod announcement into an ideological battleground which (to my view) is only reinforced by the "I think you should have done this... and your forum moderation sucks..." ethos.
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Offline NiGHTMARE

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Re: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!
« Reply #97 on: October 13, 2005, 05:24:29 AM »
Now, as for my contribution to the foolishness, I would ask NiGHTMARE to definitively post his opinion on whether negative criticism is an acceptable thing to do or not, without any mincing, dancing, prancing, gallivanting, semanticising, or other shenanigans.

I already diid, way back on the page two.  I also pointed out that criticism and telling other people what to do are two very different things.
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Offline NiGHTMARE

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Re: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!
« Reply #98 on: October 13, 2005, 05:26:05 AM »
Ehm. No. At least not in a proper meaning of a word, a Dictator is given very special priviligies and duties, but the extend of that is governed by law, of course a dictator may feel himself above law as well as a e.g. mayor but in no way is it a prerequirement. :)

Erm, yes.  At least according to the non-compact version of Oxford English dictionary, and if anywhere has the "proper meaning of the word", it's there.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2005, 05:28:56 AM by NiGHTMARE »
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Offline Borsook

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Re: The Jerry Zinger Show has been released!
« Reply #99 on: October 13, 2005, 05:53:34 AM »
@Nightmare - I meant the position in Roman state not the modern common misusage. I.e. in modern times you cannot have a position of a Dictator, there's no such thing, only people being called like that. Saying somebody is an ass doesn't make him a female donkey...

PS. Please don't treat this too seriously...
« Last Edit: October 13, 2005, 05:55:48 AM by Borsook »
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