Moiya bug

[Heckur]

Found a little bug: I was called to go to Moiya. I went to the slumbs and saw a red-circled thug. I attacked immediately. Then I saw it were 3 thugs, threatening Moiya. Nobody talked, the user interface disapeared and my party was endlessly pumping missiles in the thug. Reloaded, switched of AI and all went OK.

Later on, when looking for Celile, a thug appeared before the CC. He was red-circled. Should that be? I mean, I was a little wiser this time and didn't attack him on the spot, but as the thug is a messenger, should he be blue-circled?

[SimDing0™]

The cutscene should be kicking in before you get the chance to attack them. I'll make sure it works properly in the next release.

[yakosparks]

I had the same bug, the woman just ran scared (morale failure) because the beating she got so I couldn't talk to her.

[cybrwurm]

Hi all. I think I found a bug in the money-lender quest (in the quest pack).
I got to the point where I pay the thug 6250 gp, and he tells me to go find
Carla in the graveyard district. I then go talk with Moiya, and it's off to
the GD. I found Carla in one of the tombs near the center of the district,
but whenever I go to talk with her I always get the same message:
Girl - had nothing to say to you
In other words, the quest stalls at that point and can't be completed.
Most aggravating, yes? What, if anything, can be done about this?

[SimDing0™]

This is fixed for the next release, but for now, if you want to continue, setting the following variables using the console will let the girl speak:

"SPRITE_IS_DEADd0thug2","GLOBAL",1
"SPRITE_IS_DEADd0thug3","GLOBAL",1

[cybrwurm]

What and where is this console thingy, and how do I use it?

[mcruz]

The console thingy is the same one you use when for example typing in a cheat code:

Basically press CTRL-Space, type in the lines that Sim has given you and this should set the variables that will enable you to talk to the little girl. 

You may need to enable the command console (just like enabling the cheat codes) by typing Debug Mode=1 under the heading [Program Options] in the baldur.ini file found in the game directory but I'm not sure if this step is require in this case. 

[cybrwurm]

> mcruz wrote: The console thingy is the same one you use when
> for example typing in a cheat code: ...
.
 wurm say: I never use cheat codes, so therefore I never use the console thingy.
.
> You may need to enable the command console ...
> but I'm not sure if this step is require in this case.
.
 Yes, it is required. If you don't add the line to baldur.ini the game program
simply ignores the command. Or rather it treats it as the pause/unpause
command.
.
 In any case, I did as you said, but it did not help. When I entered the first
line it came back with ->  lua: syntax error
I entered the line exactly as given above, with the quotes and all. And I
even tried it both ways: ...d0thug2 and ...dOthug2. No dice, same error
either way. Obviously something is not quite right with the lines as given.
Which means I'm right back where I started; going nowhere fast!

[Kish]

CLUAConsole:SetGlobal("SPRITE_IS_DEADd0thug2","GLOBAL",1)
CLUAConsole:SetGlobal("SPRITE_IS_DEADd0thug3","GLOBAL",1)

Try those.

[rreinier]

Not sure if this has been brought up before, but I see a few problems with the numbers involved in this quest:

One, 5000 gold is a HUGE amount of money, and I mean HUGE. Probably more gold then most Athkatlan nobles will ever have in their lives.
Two, the notion that one has to pay a whopping 25% interest over a period of SIX days is laughable. At that rate, nobody would ever loan anything from him.
Three, I thought the woman's husband had been gone for years. How does this correspond with the moneylender's statement that the 5000 gold was lent for a period of six days?

[SimDing0™]

One, 5000 gold is a HUGE amount of money, and I mean HUGE. Probably more gold then most Athkatlan nobles will ever have in their lives.

Given how quickly you can amass such a sum, and the amounts of gold that go flying around in shops, temples and so on, it doesn't seem like such a huge amount.

Two, the notion that one has to pay a whopping 25% interest over a period of SIX days is laughable. At that rate, nobody would ever loan anything from him.

He takes advantage of the needy. That's how he operates. However, six days is an arbitrary number, so if you've got any suggestions on a period of time that would be more balanced or logical...

Three, I thought the woman's husband had been gone for years. How does this correspond with the moneylender's statement that the 5000 gold was lent for a period of six days?

She doesn't say "years", but rather "some time ago". Given that we've got a period of time inbetween where she mentions receiving help from the temple of Ilmater, it doesn't seem inconceivable that the statements fit together.

[rreinier]

One, 5000 gold is a HUGE amount of money, and I mean HUGE. Probably more gold then most Athkatlan nobles will ever have in their lives.

Given how quickly you can amass such a sum, and the amounts of gold that go flying around in shops, temples and so on, it doesn't seem like such a huge amount.

Yes, but we're adventurers, exploring dungeons and discovering huge quantities of treasure. Also, the gold we leave at shops pays for magic. If you consider that a long sword, which is an very valuable weapon (if it's a good one) costs only a few gold pieces, I'd say that one gold piece would be enough to support a normal family for a month at least, probably several. Which is as it should be, since gold as a raw material is hugely expensive.

Two, the notion that one has to pay a whopping 25% interest over a period of SIX days is laughable. At that rate, nobody would ever loan anything from him.

He takes advantage of the needy. That's how he operates. However, six days is an arbitrary number, so if you've got any suggestions on a period of time that would be more balanced or logical...

One year would be an absolute minimum for such an interest rate. I'd say make it two or three, that'd make the whole scenario a bit more credible, since you'd have the Marlowe-effect: The woman buys considerable luxury for a long time, and will not have to worry about the possible concequences until much later.

Of course, even if she has three years to spend it, a sum of as little as 500 gold would provide her with a lot of luxury. I'd say take the last "0" off the numbers, and maybe dress the woman up as a noblewoman...

[neriana]

He's a loanshark basically, right? 25% interest for even a short-term loan is perfectly normal there. (So sayeth Law and Order at least.)

I think gold should be based on other amounts of gold within the game, not what you'd be getting in a p&p game. 5000 seems fine.

[belboz]

25% for a six-day loan, if anything, sounds too *reasonable* for a loan shark. 25% as a high-end APR may be what we're used to in our world of usury laws, large credit granters, and record-low prime rates, but I think even a payday loan (today's closest legal approximation to loan-sharking) is something like 15% interest a week. Outrageous? Maybe, but people who are desperate for cash will submit to a lot.

Question: Celie is marked as an innocent, which means killing him can result in a pretty sizeable rep hit...even after you've seen him kidnap a small girl and hold her hostage in a graveyard. Is this really intentional? He seems pretty incredibly nasty.

[SimDing0™]

Yes, you incur a rep hit and people turn hostile because killing people in the open in the Copper Coronet isn't a terribly reputable thing to do. Now that you mention it though, I need to check that you don't get a Virtue hit for killing him in the Coronet.

[iommimetal]

Celile the disappeared after i cluaconsoled the thugs on the roof of copper coronet! When Moyia tells me to go and speak to celile after the kidnapping of Carla, he's nowhere to be found. What should i do?

[Qwinn]

Do

CLUAConsole:CreateCreature("d0thug"). 

I'm pretty sure You'll actually need to do it twice - you need to have two separate conversations with the thug.

Qwinn

[iommimetal]

Do

CLUAConsole:CreateCreature("d0thug"). 

I'm pretty sure You'll actually need to do it twice - you need to have two separate conversations with the thug.

Qwinn

Did that twice and then went save the girl from the graveyard (and did proper set global-things to get her to move along... ) Back to slums and where's Moiya? What should i clua console next?! How will i ever end this quest!

[Qwinn]

It's -very- odd that Moiya isn't there, because nothing gets rid of her after she tells you to find her daughter.  She should still be wherever it was you had created her before.

If she isn't, for whatever bizarre reason, then I believe it's CreateCreature("d0poor"), just like last time you had to creater her.

Qwinn

[iommimetal]

It's -very- odd that Moiya isn't there, because nothing gets rid of her after she tells you to find her daughter.  She should still be wherever it was you had created her before.

If she isn't, for whatever bizarre reason, then I believe it's CreateCreature("d0poor"), just like last time you had to creater her.

Qwinn

Quest is finally over. Thanks for the assistance.