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Topic Summary

Posted by: Echon
« on: March 09, 2018, 03:12:06 AM »

Quote from: subtledoctor on March 08, 2018, 11:01:29 AM
Oh fucking spare me dude. Deal with bad actors, or don't. And if you don't, don't be surprised when other people do and discussion turns to shit.

I don't give a shit, I already blocked that fool.

Quote from: me on March 08, 2018, 11:59:23 AM
He is telling you to stop acting like a whiny little drama queen, just like I told you in the other forum. No need to throw a tantrum, Doc.

Too bad you haven't got your meds yet.  ::)

I am telling you to stop posting shit like this.


1. Take your personal wars elsewhere.
2. Stick to the topic at hand. If in doubt, see #1.

I would prefer not to delete posts, ban users, or something similar but that is up to you.
Posted by: me
« on: March 08, 2018, 11:59:23 AM »

Quote from: subtledoctor on March 08, 2018, 11:01:29 AM
Oh fucking spare me dude.
He is telling you to stop acting like a whiny little drama queen, just like I told you in the other forum. No need to throw a tantrum, Doc.

Too bad you haven't got your meds yet.  ::)
Posted by: subtledoctor
« on: March 08, 2018, 11:01:29 AM »

Oh fucking spare me dude. Deal with bad actors, or don't. And if you don't, don't be surprised when other people do and discussion turns to shit.

I don't give a shit, I already blocked that fool.
Posted by: Echon
« on: March 07, 2018, 02:15:10 PM »

Keep the quips and personal attacks out of this forum, both of you. And don't make me have to repeat this.
Posted by: me
« on: March 06, 2018, 02:15:44 PM »

Quote from: subtledoctor on March 06, 2018, 12:40:17 PM
I don't know whether AL|EN's specific example was a good one...
Then maybe you shouldn't have jumped into his argument if you're not familiar with it? :)

Quote
I just opined as to the overall point that making changes without testing the effects is never a good idea if there is an alternative that can make more directed, limited, and tested changes.
Again, I have to hand it to you for this mind-blowing statement.  I'm sure it never crossed the minds of the developers in the past 15 years of Weidu's progress.  ::)

Quote
For instance, if Old_Mod ship with a version of Weidu that has a buggy regexp implemenation, the FixPack could simply overwrite setup-Old_Mod.exe with a newer version.
Yes, let's have the BWP fixpack take over for Weidu while it's being actively maintained and have the fixpack carry outdated, unsupported versions in its stead. You are digging yourself into a hole you can't crawl out of, Doctor.

Get some rest, Doc. Perhaps you're overdosed on a few too many Dayquils. ;D  ;D
Posted by: AL|EN
« on: March 06, 2018, 02:03:11 PM »

Quote from: subtledoctor on March 06, 2018, 12:40:17 PM
In fact, this is so hypothetical that I'm not even sure why it's being discussed. Is it really worth the effort of arguing? (Setting aside trolling by anonymous cowards, which will happen no matter what.  :-Zzz )
Not really: wiedu is a framework which is bound to the IE/game version. When modding framework version will be bound bound to mod, and a mod is bound to game version, that's rock-solid consistency.

wisp already agree, but I personally needs some decisions/timelines in order to start working for BWS replacement.
Posted by: subtledoctor
« on: March 06, 2018, 12:40:17 PM »

Quote from: The Imp on March 05, 2018, 12:24:16 PM
a regexp that concerns 60 000 files in the overwrite folder doesn't work in the v185 even if it was originally programmed for that weidu.exe, while it does in the v24200 todays, no matter were it to ran in with only one renamed weidu.exe in the folder.

And if it's so easy to fix the weidu -programming with a fixpack, then why the hell is there even more than 1 weidu.exe ever released ? (a .exe or whatever OS you use it with)

I don't know whether AL|EN's specific example was a good one... I just opined as to the overall point that making changes without testing the effects is never a good idea if there is an alternative that can make more directed, limited, and tested changes.

For instance, if Old_Mod ship with a version of Weidu that has a buggy regexp implemenation, the FixPack could simply overwrite setup-Old_Mod.exe with a newer version. If Other_Mod performs perfectly well with its old version of Weidu, it need not be overwritten.

Again, all very hypothetically.

In fact, this is so hypothetical that I'm not even sure why it's being discussed. Is it really worth the effort of arguing? (Setting aside trolling by anonymous cowards, which will happen no matter what.  :-Zzz )
Posted by: me
« on: March 05, 2018, 02:13:09 PM »

Appreciate the suggestion, darling. Be sure to direct that to the Doc as well.
Posted by: Echon
« on: March 05, 2018, 01:56:28 PM »

@me

We appreciate it when people are not dicks. For instance, dickery includes obvious trolling or being overly condencending. Try not to be a dick.
Posted by: me
« on: March 05, 2018, 12:58:46 PM »

Seems I've made Dr. Subtle (PhD in Bullshitology) upset.  ;D

Quote from: subtledoctor on March 05, 2018, 11:56:07 AM
A one-size fits all solution that makes unpredictable changes with no testing, makes no sense.
No one said there wouldn't be any testing, genius. That's what betas are for. Using multiple unsupported versions of Weidu concurrently (especially ones that are very old) makes no sense. I wouldn't expect a simpleton like yourself to understand that.

Wisp had already indicated handling stack management outside of Weidu has been on his mind for a while. Nevertheless, your profound suggestion has been duly noted.  ::)

Quote
If updating Weidu would help, rather than hinder, the function of a mod, it would be ridiculously easy to address it with a fixpack.
A fixpack for WeiDU.  ;D ;D ;D

Great. Just what everyone needed. Let's complicate matters further by creating another unneeded "fix" for WeiDU itself.
Posted by: The Imp
« on: March 05, 2018, 12:24:16 PM »

Quote from: subtledoctor on March 05, 2018, 11:56:07 AM
Sigh. As usual the troglodyte stalker has nothing useful to add.
Not a thing you did listen, but had you actually done so, you would understand that a regexp that concerns 60 000 files in the overwrite folder doesn't work in the v185 even if it was originally programmed for that weidu.exe, while it does in the v24200 todays, no matter were it to ran in with only one renamed weidu.exe in the folder.

And if it's so easy to fix the weidu -programming with a fixpack, then why the hell is there even more than 1 weidu.exe ever released ? (a .exe or whatever OS you use it with)
Posted by: subtledoctor
« on: March 05, 2018, 11:56:07 AM »

Sigh. As usual the troglodyte stalker has nothing useful to add.

A one-size fits all solution that makes unpredictable changes with no testing, makes no sense. Presuming (very hypothetically) that a new program will be produced that has the capability to manage stack operations separately, mods should ideally be preserved in the state of their last tested configuration.

If updating Weidu would help, rather than hinder, the function of a mod, it would be ridiculously easy to address it with a fixpack.
Posted by: me
« on: March 04, 2018, 10:05:47 AM »

Typical retarded, narrow-minded response from the not-so-subtle doctor. Why am I not surprised?  ::)

Quote from: subtledoctor on March 04, 2018, 08:52:07 AM
the .tp2 was written for the older version of regexp, and changing the version of regexp without changing the way the code uses it will almost certainly cause problems
The tp2 was wasn't written for any particular version of regexp. The mod author wouldn't have known or cared about how the underlying mechanism worked. All that matters is whether it worked according to the standards. We know it didn't work when pushed to its limits. Otherwise, it wouldn't have been changed. The argument ends there.

You really shouldn't talk about things that are out of your depth. Stick to things you are good at... like whining.  ;)
Posted by: subtledoctor
« on: March 04, 2018, 08:52:07 AM »

Quote from: me on March 03, 2018, 05:36:45 AM
Quote from: subtledoctor on February 28, 2018, 03:25:36 PM
Quote from: me on February 17, 2018, 05:53:44 AM
Obviously Alien does, since he claims the version that came with the mod would always work without issues.
I don't think AL|EN ever claimed that.
Then maybe you should go back and re-read what he wrote. He was using the "they changed regexp" as an argument without specifically giving a reason why he prefers the old regexp. He doesn't consider the possibility that maybe the change is for the better; that maybe there was a technical limitation or simply an inherent flaw in the way it was coded.
Quote

Um, yes, he did consider that.  The newer version of regexp is no doubt better; but the .tp2 was written for the older version of regexp, and changing the version of regexp without changing the way the code uses it will almost certainly cause problems, while retaining the older, inferior version of regexp might at least work with the code as written.  Blind change without testing is just, well, dumb.

Quote from: me on March 03, 2018, 05:36:45 AM
Quote from: subtledoctor on February 28, 2018, 03:25:36 PM
The point is a simple one: we at least know that mod has been tested and released with that Weidu version.
It's not that simple. We don't know the extent to which it was tested. Usually, the mod author would've tested it on his pc in a limited environment and assumed it works as long as it doesn't throw errors.
Quote
You are correct in the (extremely) limited sense of acknowledging that the operative question is, what information do we have?  We don't know to what extent it was tested (though, of course, you could go back through the forums and check)... but we DO know how much it was tested with the newer, changed version of Weidu: zero.  By simple logic, [>= 0] >
  • .


Of course you may not care a whit about logic... and judging by your trolling on the other forum and general lack of reading comprehension, you don't.  :P

Quote from: me on March 03, 2018, 05:36:45 AM
Quote from: subtledoctor on February 28, 2018, 03:25:36 PM
Best practice, in the absence of any other concerns (!) would pretty clearly be to have each mod use the version of Weidu that it last shipped with.
Best practice, statistically, would be clearly to use the newer Weidu.

When using an argument that depends utterly on the word "statistically" for its soundness, you might want to, y'know, provide some statistics that bear it out.  Otherwise the point is worthless.
Posted by: me
« on: March 03, 2018, 05:36:45 AM »

Quote from: subtledoctor on February 28, 2018, 03:25:36 PM
Quote from: me on February 17, 2018, 05:53:44 AM
Obviously Alien does, since he claims the version that came with the mod would always work without issues.
I don't think AL|EN ever claimed that.
Then maybe you should go back and re-read what he wrote. He was using the "they changed regexp" as an argument without specifically giving a reason why he prefers the old regexp. He doesn't consider the possibility that maybe the change is for the better; that maybe there was a technical limitation or simply an inherent flaw in the way it was coded.

Quote
The point is a simple one: we at least know that mod has been tested and released with that Weidu version.
It's not that simple. We don't know the extent to which it was tested. Usually, the mod author would've tested it on his pc in a limited environment and assumed it works as long as it doesn't throw errors.

Quote
Best practice, in the absence of any other concerns (!) would pretty clearly be to have each mod use the version of Weidu that it last shipped with.
Best practice, statistically, would be clearly to use the newer Weidu. Chances are, it would have most likely fixed any such boundary cases where Weidu chokes (like the 60000-file limit) or simply bugs in the macros (like that fj_add_are_struct macro that had to be modified several times because there were certain instances when it used to cause crashes).