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Topic Summary

Posted by: Xander77
« on: July 13, 2004, 09:16:55 PM »

Hmm...

How about a Pirate attack?

As we remember, the reason you had no problems with them on the way to spellhold was because Saemon signaled them away.

Then the Shahuagin attack anyway, with pirate dialogue on how that's a common occurance lately.

If we feel like preserving the lives of the crew, what about a Shahuagin spell that carries you underwater?
Posted by: Necaradan
« on: July 13, 2004, 06:53:38 PM »

Why allow me to keep one extra NPC just for the duration of the Brynnlaw quests? The PC wouldn't know that there is going to be a chance to smuggle an NPC back so if he was going make room in the party for Imoen wouldn't he do it before leaving mainland?

Either way you still have to abanbon someone before entering spellhold....maybe you could make it so that Imoen or an abandoned NPC would follow you through spellhold as an ally...this idea is pretty dumb and I suspect would be bothersome to implement.

Hmm is it possible to smuggle Yoshimo back and then pick him up later as an NPC for TOB use? (on second thought I just remembered he will die from not fufilling his task anyway)

Ah who cares - If you build it, they will come...
Posted by: rreinier
« on: July 07, 2004, 04:19:20 PM »

It's exactly my point that the PC never planned to go to the Underdark. Saemon promised to set him/her ashore close to Suldanessellar, since that was where we knew Jonaleth was going.

And it doesn't matter that the PC gets attacked no matter what. As you pointed out yourself, there is only one journey. By an preprogrammed extreme coincidence, the PC gets attacked on that journey.

To say that a PC can't get attacked every time is like saying "Why does Ellesime keep saying the Elves leaned from their mistake, when everytime I start a new game, I find that they cursed another Elf?"
Posted by: mcruz
« on: July 07, 2004, 03:21:11 PM »

which is exactly my point, while the Sahuagin attacks may be random in the actual game it is always programmed to happen so that's why it's weird  that you always get attacked (not that I mind of course, and one could say that this only happens once since reloading from a saved game is not the same as going with Saemon over and over again)

but yeah the attack on Saemon's ship by the Sahuagin was most likely a random attack, I'm just saying that because of its randomness then "if the PC got on another ship" then how likely is it that the Sahuagin will attack this ship too?? (after all going to Brynnlaw was Sahuagin-free......)  ;D

Quote from: rreinier on July 07, 2004, 04:32:46 AM
Also, I think that skipping the entire Underdark is out of the question, since it's a chapter in the story all by itself. Entering the Underdark via the same way we exit it is also illogical, because there'd be no reason to enter it if we're already where we want to be (namely outside).

I just think that if the PC chosed to go with Saemon.......then the PC probably planned either to go directly where Irenicus might have been going or back to Aran Linvail......and not to the Underdark (not that I'm against going there), I'm only saying that had the Sahuagin not attacked then who knows what would have happened....
Posted by: rreinier
« on: July 07, 2004, 04:32:46 AM »

Quote
Definitely it's safe to assume that the Sahuagin randomly attacked ships, but if the PC was to somehow secure another means of getting off Brynnlaw (i.e Calahan's ship or another ship) then the attack by the Sahuagin might not happen unless (a) the Sahuagin attacked all ships (b) the Sahuagin while randomly attacking ships were also vigilant as to some sign involving the prophecy (c) the PC is cursed or the Sahuagin are lucky 

of course it would be shame to miss out on the Sahuagin city and the Underdark........
I disagree. By that logic, the Sahuagin are also very lucky because they manage to find Saemon's ship on every run through the game...

It's just a pure coincidence, story-internally, that the PC's ship gets attacked. The PC doesn't know that it's scripted to happen whichever route he takes...

Also, I think that skipping the entire Underdark is out of the question, since it's a chapter in the story all by itself. Entering the Underdark via the same way we exit it is also illogical, because there'd be no reason to enter it if we're already where we want to be (namely outside).
Posted by: mcruz
« on: July 07, 2004, 02:37:11 AM »

Quote from: rreinier on July 06, 2004, 04:09:56 PM
Well, if they don't, I don't see how the PC is going to reach the Underdark...

There might be other ways to reach the Underdark (i.e there is an entrance where Elhan and the other elves are camped, the portal in Spellhold, etc)

Also, I'm not sure if I remember exactly but the idea of going with Saemon Haevarian (i.e stealing a ship from the Pirate Lord) was so that the PC and company would not have to go through the Underdark chasing Irenicus......so in terms of the story the only reasons for going to the Underdark would be to foil the plans of Irenicus' allies (i.e the drow) and to run into Elhan (with no way of avoiding this encounter).....

Quote from: Cybersquirt on July 06, 2004, 07:33:22 PM

[I'm going with Nightmare on this, they're just randomly attacking ships]


Definitely it's safe to assume that the Sahuagin randomly attacked ships, but if the PC was to somehow secure another means of getting off Brynnlaw (i.e Calahan's ship or another ship) then the attack by the Sahuagin might not happen unless (a) the Sahuagin attacked all ships (b) the Sahuagin while randomly attacking ships were also vigilant as to some sign involving the prophecy (c) the PC is cursed or the Sahuagin are lucky  :D

of course it would be shame to miss out on the Sahuagin city and the Underdark........
Posted by: rreinier
« on: July 07, 2004, 02:25:07 AM »

Well, according to those dialogues you were "taken" to their city, which suggests a concious action. Also, the Sahuagin knew of your coming beforehand, there were sighns that it would happen.
Posted by: Cybersquirt
« on: July 06, 2004, 07:33:22 PM »

Githyanki: The Githyanki demand! You have the relic of holies!
Saemon: Pardon? I am sorry, but I do not know what you are talking about. Speak clearly that I might understand.
Gith: Understand! We see all that you do! Say mon HaVaran, you have trespassed and taken what is not yours!
...
Gith: The Blade belonging to the Githyanki is aboard! Detection does not lie! All will perish for this insult!
...
Gith: Sahuagin?  I did not anticipate this.  Back to the ship!

(sahuagin, it appears, only speak with the overhead text)

[Then, in the Sahuagin city:]
What'er name: ...In good time, Feerlattiys.  Allow them to gain their bearings and discover why we have brought them here.  Otherwise, they may resort to hostilities.

Indeed.  Sekolah has spoken of these ones to us, so let us treat them not as prisoners for the banquet table.  Let us instead make them welcome.

I shall introduce myself to you.  I am Senityili, Royal High Priestess of Sekolah.  And you are in the City-of-Caverns, one of our most ancient places.

You are fortunate, surface dwellers.  In the normal course of things, creatures captured from the sun lands would be dinner for our plate.

This once, however, is different.  Sekolah has told of your coming in an ancient prophecy, and I have scryed that you are whom the Shark-Father speaks of.

The most exalted King Ixilthetocal calls for the presence of the prophesied ones, now, but there is time for you to ask questions if you have the desire.

...

We... Sahuagin, as you call us... have watched and waited from our temples here in the City.  The signs have come, surface <PRO_MANWOMAN>, and now you are here.

You have come... and the City-of-Caverns does, indeed, stand on the brink of destruction.  You will save us, as Sekolah has promised.

[So, there is nothing definitive in the dialogue.  Our journal entry doesn't add much:]

Journal entry:
The prophecy of Sekolah

Taken down into a city far below the ocean surface by the Sahuagin, I was greeted by High Priestess Senityili of the shark god Sekolah and told that I was intended for some higher purpose that Sekolah had fortold in a prophecy.

[I'm going with Nightmare on this, they're just randomly attacking ships]

Random guard: You are... the surface creatures.  I have fought many of your kind on raids to the surface shores.  The most exalted one has commanded your safety... for now.

Royal Sahuagin: They are nothing more than spurious beasts that have fallen into our lap.  We should sacrifice them and feast upon their meat!
Posted by: Cybersquirt
« on: July 06, 2004, 07:02:29 PM »

Quote from: rreinier on July 05, 2004, 03:59:41 PM
But the Githyanki attack is irrelevant. The Sahuagin didn't have a special reason to attack this particular ship, and it's their attack that sinks the ship.
Er.. it could also be argued that had the Gith not been aboard, we could just take the Sahuagin out.

The way I always understood it: the Sahuagin attacked ships randomly, the Gith divined the Silver Sword aboard Saemon's ship and board first, right?  The only reason the PC is (later) saved by the Sahuagin is because s/he's The One (and if I could find the boarding dialogues, this might be made clearer).

edit: and, now that I think about it (the actual dialogue), I seem to remember a lot of floating text.  ::)  Where would that be found?
Posted by: rreinier
« on: July 06, 2004, 04:09:56 PM »

Well, if they don't, I don't see how the PC is going to reach the Underdark...
Posted by: mcruz
« on: July 06, 2004, 02:52:16 PM »

Quote from: Lord Kain on July 06, 2004, 02:19:18 PM
the most obvious reason is the Priestess saw the PC's party and realized she could use them to kill the King and put the prince into power.

too bad she didn't foersee what the king would do after she "convinced" him that the PC was the one

Quote from: Lord Kain on July 06, 2004, 02:19:18 PM
Also by throwing in the idea that the smuggler can get the PC and party out kinda means Gina and her brother die because they went down with the ship.

Assuming the Sahuagin will attack any ship that the PC gets on....
Posted by: Lord Kain
« on: July 06, 2004, 02:19:18 PM »

the most obvious reason is the Priestess saw the PC's party and realized she could use them to kill the King and put the prince into power. Why they attacked the ship in the first place is up in the air. Also by throwing in the idea that the smuggler can get the PC and party out kinda means Gina and her brother die because they went down with the ship.
Posted by: mcruz
« on: July 05, 2004, 05:06:55 PM »

yeah it's not very clear (probably the Sahuagin attempted to board the ship for the usual reasons except that things got more complicated with the Githyanki being onboard as well) it just seems more plausible that the PC was brought to the Sahuagin city rather than by pure sheer luck
Posted by: rreinier
« on: July 05, 2004, 04:55:56 PM »

I thought that you were initially just a target to them, but when the undercurrent brought you alive and well to their city, they started to think you might be someone special...
Posted by: mcruz
« on: July 05, 2004, 04:50:31 PM »

I always assumed that the Sahaugin attack was someow related to the whole prophecy of an outsider coming to save their city and for this reason they monitored the surface for signs of his/her coming........