Author Topic: Romance Conclusion  (Read 14297 times)

Offline weimer

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Romance Conclusion
« on: July 23, 2002, 08:57:16 PM »
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[!-Post: 7-!][!-Time: 1013134814-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST7]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:weimer@cs.berkeley.edu"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Westley Weimer (Admin)[!-/Name-!][/a] on Thursday, February 07, 2002 - 06:20 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] The Solaufein romance features two distinct endings based on the PC's conversation choices (somewhat like Anomen's test). Each ending comes with a different associated reward for Solaufein.  
 
I'm personally curious about which route people are taking. What did you find at the end of the romance?  Were you role-playing yourself or a particular character?  
 
This topic contains spoilers, please leave some sort of space to avoid giving away the conclusion to those who don't want to see it yet. [!-/Text-!] [p]

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[!-Post: 37-!][!-Time: 1013739805-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST37]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:stoneyacres@net-port.com"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]ShaylaDormyr[!-/Name-!][/a] on Thursday, February 14, 2002 - 06:23 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] I *think* I'm at the end...  darns it all.  That was too fun to end.  At least, this is what happened at the 'end'...    
Beware... SPOILER AHEAD.....
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Sola asked to go out in the woods away from the city.  He was visited by his Goddess and received an AWSOME sword...  The moonblade.  Is that a custome job, by the way?  Then he professed his love and loyalty.  That was near the end of SoA.  Now we beat Iranicus and are in ToB and he hasn't spoke a word to me yet...  =(
 
As for my roleplaying, all my characters have something of me in them.  So I'd have to say both roleplaying myself and my char.  I played a Kensai/Theif, NG.  I think I roleplayed kinda close to that alignment.  
 
So, is this the end or will he talk to me more yet?  I liked our little dances... walks in the woods...  oh, sorry... ahem.  
 
Great Mod Westley!  Thanks for making it! [!-/Text-!] [p]

[!-/Post: 37-!]
[!-Post: 38-!][!-Time: 1013835280-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST38]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:weimer@cs.berkeley.edu"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Westley Weimer (Admin)[!-/Name-!][/a] on Friday, February 15, 2002 - 08:54 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] OK, you got Tsuki no Ken. At least two others have gotten the Moonblade (because they reported a bug in it). So far no one seems to have gotten the Moonray and Memorization reward (perhaps pragmatism always wins in real life).  
 
Anyway, yes it's a custom job. It appears "awesome" so that you will at least consider using it, but careful inspection will reveal that it probably pales in comparison to, e.g., Carsomyr, Foebane +5 or Ravager +6. I had to make it sufficiently powerful that you would still want to use it in ToB and sufficiently weak that it is not the best item in the game. Did it work?  
 
There should be at least one more dialogue with Sola -- it takes place at night and out of doors. He'll offer some nookie :-). If you never ever see this, you may have an old version with the SoA-]ToB "freeze the romance bug", at which point you should upgrade and then talk to solaufein directly by clicking on him. He'll say "I have nothing to say" but he will "unfreeze" and talk to you later.
 
Is this the end? Well, just today I completed a final Solaufein "challenge" (to take place after the nookie but definitely in ToB). I've also upgraded my dialogue compiler to make banter easier, and I have the Mazzy and Edwin banter completed. The bottleneck now is actually coming up with ideas for things to say, so I'll probably solicit advice on the main board.
 
Assuming that I release some new banter-ful version before you complete ToB you'll be able to take advantage of all of his banter and this final challenge in your current game. [!-/Text-!] [p]

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[!-Post: 40-!][!-Time: 1013884073-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST40]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:stoneyacres@net-port.com"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]ShaylaDormyr[!-/Name-!][/a] on Saturday, February 16, 2002 - 10:27 am:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] I ran a game from a save after that nasty fight with the handmaiden.  My char took the more aggressive approach.  After being visited by his Goddess he said that she 'healed the weak', but I didn't know exactly what he meant or where to look for a difference.  Which one was this?
 
Actually, that is why I said it was awsome.  It is not overly powerful where I'd rush him into a hack/slash combat nor is it wimpy to the point where when I do need him in hand to hand that it is useless.  It works fine for me. No probs at all.  
 
Thank you for adding to it!!!  =)  I'll just keep the game I have on hold until you release it.  It wouldn't be any fun going through ToB with Sola being all quiet and all. [!-/Text-!] [p]

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[!-Post: 43-!][!-Time: 1013894115-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST43]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:weimer@cs.berkeley.edu"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Westley Weimer (Admin)[!-/Name-!][/a] on Saturday, February 16, 2002 - 01:15 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] If you give Sola compassionate, self-sacrificing, altruistic lawful-good type advice the whole time (or at least more often than not) you'll get the Moonray instead of the sword. First he gains two extra spell slots in each level (making him more like Edwin). Second he can gains an innate Sunray-like ability that he can use thrice a day. It heals the party and smites nearby foes (even non-undead ones).  
 
However, I have no idea if the two options are equivalently powerful (mostly since I haven't heard from anyone who got the moonray one). I may have to run through the game once with it to make a comparison. [!-/Text-!] [p]

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[!-Post: 607-!][!-Time: 1018557651-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST607]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="javascript:alert('The e-mail address and profile information for the individual posting this message is not available.')" onMouseOver="window.status = 'The e-mail address and profile information for the individual posting this message is not available.'; return true"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Sophia[!-/Name-!][/a] on Thursday, April 11, 2002 - 01:40 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] I played myself really, and from my conversation responses, Solaufein was given the Moonray and Memorization award.  I was pleased with it.  I haven't tried out the Moonray with an enemy yet, so I don't know how powerful it is, but the reward seemed very appropriate.  I've completed the romance and am just sad that it's over!  I've been putting off going to deal with Bodhi until the romance was done.  If she doesn't take Solaufein, I will be very disappointed, but aside from that, the romance has been excellent.  I just wish it would continue [img SRC="http://manju.cs.berkeley.edu/~weimer/discus/clipart/happy.gif" ALT=":)"]
 
Sophia [!-/Text-!] [p]

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[!-Post: 632-!][!-Time: 1018756360-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST632]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:weimer@cs.berkeley.edu"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Westley Weimer (Admin)[!-/Name-!][/a] on Saturday, April 13, 2002 - 08:52 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] Thanks for the report, Sophia. I have added a bodhi-abduction to the Solaufein TODO list. [!-/Text-!] [p]
[!-/Post: 632-!]
[!-Post: 690-!][!-Time: 1018953492-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST690]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:l.boscaratto@bates.it"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Luciana[!-/Name-!][/a] on Tuesday, April 16, 2002 - 03:38 am:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] I noticed as well that I felt a bit disappointed the latest time I played through the romance and realized that in Suldanessalar it was, well...over.
 
I know that you Wes are fond of though fights (I'm starting appreciating them as well...) and that Solaufein's romance is really unique just because it's universal (no gender specific, no exclusive, no SoA/ToB strictly related...) and I DO IMAGINE HOW BUSY YOU ARE.
 
But.... :-) ...there will ever be any chance to add some romance dialogs in order to continue the romance in ToB?  
Just considering that if you're willing to:
 - get your fav character as soon as possible,  
 - play with him in the group part of the underdark/2 chapter quests,  
 - have him abducted from bodhi and so on...
...the romance will (almost) always finish in SoA??????  
 
No doubts, no quarrels, no questions, no crisis during all ToB adventures?  
I personally gave up my latest game after beating Irenicus for this very reason...  
 
...ehm...will you pleazzz add my proposal at VERY END fo your todo list....pleazzzz! [!-/Text-!] [p]

[!-/Post: 690-!]
[!-Post: 694-!][!-Time: 1018973804-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST694]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:weimer@cs.berkeley.edu"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Westley Weimer (Admin)[!-/Name-!][/a] on Tuesday, April 16, 2002 - 09:16 am:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!][font SIZE="-2"][font COLOR="0000ff"]...ehm...will you pleazzz add my proposal at VERY END fo your todo list....pleazzzz![/font][/font]
 
Sure.  
 
It's actually very easy to add romance content (especially the just-talking kind), provided that I have something to say. For example, I was able to whip up the Solaufein-Vampire commentary (which I actually like) in about the time it took to write it down.  
 
The problem is that my muse seems to have deserted me with respect to other things to say. If you (or anyone else) could make some more concrete suggestions about things you think Sola would talk about (e.g., "quarrels" about what?) that might suddenly gift me with the inspiration required to write something up.  
 
Thanks again for your continuing interest in the Sola mod and your stellar translation efforts.[!-/Text-!] [p]

[!-/Post: 694-!]
[!-Post: 761-!][!-Time: 1019161003-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST761]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="javascript:alert('The e-mail address and profile information for the individual posting this message is not available.')" onMouseOver="window.status = 'The e-mail address and profile information for the individual posting this message is not available.'; return true"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]dragon wench[!-/Name-!][/a] on Thursday, April 18, 2002 - 01:16 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] Perhaps in ToB, after having some kind of "committment" discussion, Solaufein and the pc could embark on a discussion/debate on the wisdom of having a child while leading so dangerous a life????? It could have a philosophical component that would touch on the earlier child rearing conversation, and it could also possibly serve as the basis for a disagreement/quarrel.
Or possibly, make "committment" a bit of a crisis for some reason...maybe Sola still feels remorse about Phaere..or fears once again exposing himself to the raw emotion of being in love, of making himself vulnerable, since due to the perils of the adventuring life...his new love could also be snatched away.
 
Maybe even a combination of the above would work?
 
Just thoughts ;) I am sure you are very busy. [!-/Text-!] [p]

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[!-Post: 769-!][!-Time: 1019274798-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST769]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:weimer@cs.berkeley.edu"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Westley Weimer (Admin)[!-/Name-!][/a] on Friday, April 19, 2002 - 08:53 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] Thanks for your ideas. The next release will include a post-nookie banter on having children. [!-/Text-!] [p]
[!-/Post: 769-!]
[!-Post: 791-!][!-Time: 1019687363-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST791]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:pirecius_155@hotmail.com"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Falcoris[!-/Name-!][/a] on Wednesday, April 24, 2002 - 03:29 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] Wouldn't a having children baneter be odd if the PC was male??....
There are lots of things that are odd if the PC was male....
Oh well. [!-/Text-!] [p]

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[!-Post: 792-!][!-Time: 1019690179-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST792]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:weimer@cs.berkeley.edu"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Westley Weimer (Admin)[!-/Name-!][/a] on Wednesday, April 24, 2002 - 04:16 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!][font SIZE="-2"][font COLOR="0000ff"]Wouldn't a having children baneter be odd if the PC was male??.... [/font][/font]
 
No. They could pray for divine intervention or research a special spell (c.f. AD&D simulacrum). When you're epic enough to challenge the gods, this sort of thing is not a big deal.
 
[font SIZE="-2"][font COLOR="0000ff"]There are lots of things that are odd if the PC was male.... [/font][/font]
 
Not that I've noticed in the dialogue itself. The Solaufein romance is gender neutral. May I respectfully submit that any oddness you detected was carried along with you?
 
If you have a topic you'd like to suggest for Sola-PC banter, please let me know.[!-/Text-!] [p]

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[!-Post: 879-!][!-Time: 1020059144-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST879]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:Kish_K@pacbell.net"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Kish[!-/Name-!][/a] on Sunday, April 28, 2002 - 10:45 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] Or they could adopt, for that matter...I would suggest you do a gender check and make a slightly different conversation on having children for either gender, though. [!-/Text-!] [p]
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[!-Post: 1168-!][!-Time: 1021417776-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST1168]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:j_sar_a@hotmail.com"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Jes[!-/Name-!][/a] on Tuesday, May 14, 2002 - 04:09 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] Well I have to say that I have really enjoyed playing along with Solaufein.  I truly enjoyed his conversations.  Thank you for giving us this choice.
 
A child would be a fun thing to pursue as well as formalizing their relationship or discussing it at least.  Another thing which might be fun to see would be more surprises.  I enjoyed Solaufein's reaction to the group being taken from him at one point.  It was great to see his concern for my character.  Perhaps there could be other opportunities like this where circumstances might bring them closer together.
 
Anyway, thanks for adding more fun to my game! [!-/Text-!] [p]

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[!-Post: 1171-!][!-Time: 1021424404-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST1171]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:weimer@cs.berkeley.edu"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Westley Weimer (Admin)[!-/Name-!][/a] on Tuesday, May 14, 2002 - 06:00 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!][font SIZE="-2"][font COLOR="0000ff"] Well I have to say that I have really enjoyed playing along with Solaufein. I truly enjoyed his conversations. Thank you for giving us this choice. [/font][/font]
 
Thanks for taking the time to share your comments. I'm glad that you liked it.
 
[font SIZE="-2"][font COLOR="0000ff"]A child would be a fun thing to pursue[/font][/font]
 
There is one final conversation about children, but Sola isn't quite fond of them.  
 
[font SIZE="-2"][font COLOR="0000ff"]It was great to see his concern for my character. Perhaps there could be other opportunities like this where circumstances might bring them closer together.[/font][/font]
 
Yeah, Sola does need more "stuff" :-). We're working on adding conversations in the main BGII storyline.[!-/Text-!] [p]

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[!-Post: 1223-!][!-Time: 1021583002-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST1223]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:lady_alustriel@cablerocket.com"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]lady alustriel[!-/Name-!][/a] on Thursday, May 16, 2002 - 02:03 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] I definately played as myself and got the Moonray ability... pretty cool, tho I'd like to see the Moonblade as well sometime... [!-/Text-!] [p]
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[!-Post: 1227-!][!-Time: 1021590347-!]

[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST1227]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:weimer@cs.berkeley.edu"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Westley Weimer (Admin)[!-/Name-!][/a] on Thursday, May 16, 2002 - 04:05 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!][font SIZE="-2"][font COLOR="0000ff"]I definately played as myself and got the Moonray ability[/font][/font]
 
Glad to hear it. You sound like a moral person :-).
 
The Moonray isn't quite as godly as it used to be, but it's still an uber-ability compared to most of the BGII spells. :-)
 
Glad you're having fun with the mod.[!-/Text-!] [p]

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[!-Post: 1228-!][!-Time: 1021590467-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST1228]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="javascript:alert('The e-mail address and profile information for the individual posting this message is not available.')" onMouseOver="window.status = 'The e-mail address and profile information for the individual posting this message is not available.'; return true"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Tsuru[!-/Name-!][/a] on Thursday, May 16, 2002 - 04:07 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] There is one final conversation about children, but Sola isn't quite fond of them.  
 
Can I have some vague idea of when/where this would happen? It has yet to show up for me.
 
Thanks!
 
Tsuru [!-/Text-!] [p]

[!-/Post: 1228-!]
[!-Post: 1230-!][!-Time: 1021590918-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST1230]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:weimer@cs.berkeley.edu"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Westley Weimer (Admin)[!-/Name-!][/a] on Thursday, May 16, 2002 - 04:15 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!][font SIZE="-2"][font COLOR="0000ff"]Can I have some vague idea of when/where this would happen? It has yet to show up for me. [/font][/font]
 
Whoops! Due to an off-by-one scripting error (14 != 15), Sola would never have that conversation. D'oh! Fixed in next release.[!-/Text-!] [p]

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[!-Post: 1242-!][!-Time: 1021600016-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST1242]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="javascript:alert('The e-mail address and profile information for the individual posting this message is not available.')" onMouseOver="window.status = 'The e-mail address and profile information for the individual posting this message is not available.'; return true"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Tsuru[!-/Name-!][/a] on Thursday, May 16, 2002 - 06:46 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] Thanks, Westley, I'm glad it wasn't just me [img SRC="http://manju.cs.berkeley.edu/~weimer/discus/clipart/happy.gif" ALT=":)"]
 
btw, I love the ending, very nice [img SRC="http://manju.cs.berkeley.edu/~weimer/discus/clipart/happy.gif" ALT=":)"] [!-/Text-!] [p]

[!-/Post: 1242-!]
[!-Post: 1273-!][!-Time: 1021685349-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST1273]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:j_sar_a@hotmail.com"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Jes[!-/Name-!][/a] on Friday, May 17, 2002 - 06:29 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] Yay!  You added Tree of Life and Hell dialogs [img SRC="http://manju.cs.berkeley.edu/~weimer/discus/clipart/happy.gif" ALT=":)"]  I'd like to respectfully request a Master Wraith dialog too.  I never got to see the last dialog as well so now I have a lot more to look forward too.  I think I'll go back a few saves though. ;) [!-/Text-!] [p]

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[!-Post: 1275-!][!-Time: 1021686499-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST1275]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:weimer@cs.berkeley.edu"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Westley Weimer (Admin)[!-/Name-!][/a] on Friday, May 17, 2002 - 06:48 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] I have added your master wraith request to the TODO list. :-) [!-/Text-!] [p]
[!-/Post: 1275-!]
[!-Post: 1299-!][!-Time: 1021753970-!]

[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST1299]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:j_sar_a@hotmail.com"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Jes[!-/Name-!][/a] on Saturday, May 18, 2002 - 01:32 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] Thanks!  Oh and I just got to see the Tree of Life conversation and I'd like to say well done and thank you.  It fit perfectly with what I had been expecting Sola to say at that moment to my character. [!-/Text-!] [p]
[!-/Post: 1299-!]
[!-Post: 1722-!][!-Time: 1023295022-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST1722]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:dash@emerge.net.au"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Jason Whittaker[!-/Name-!][/a] on Wednesday, June 05, 2002 - 09:37 am:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] If you have time I offer a humble addition to your todo list, given the gender neutrality of the romance, I'd love to see romance conflicts with Jaheira, Aerie and especially Viconia when Sola romances a male PC, not to mention a romance conflict with Kelsey and Anomen. [!-/Text-!] [p]

[!-/Post: 1722-!]
[!-Post: 1777-!][!-Time: 1023516041-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST1777]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:j_sar_a@hotmail.com"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Jes[!-/Name-!][/a] on Friday, June 07, 2002 - 11:00 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] Oh one more thing to add to my wish list.  Something from Volo in ToB. [!-/Text-!] [p]
[!-/Post: 1777-!]
[!-Post: 2000-!][!-Time: 1024549464-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST2000]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:scarlet@fidalgo.net"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Kiki[!-/Name-!][/a] on Wednesday, June 19, 2002 - 10:04 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] I'd also like to add my votes for the Volo and Master Wraith dialogues. It was a letdown to get to those points and ... nothing. You could have Phaere come back and reveal how she always loved him in spite of the tentacle rods, or something else that might make him question his feelings for you. Voila! Conflicts galore!
 
Now that I have no romance dialogues to look forward to (and since improved Yaga-Shura took down my computer so I don't know how well Ascension is going to run), I'm sort of bored with my game too. [!-/Text-!] [p]

[!-/Post: 2000-!]
[!-Post: 2004-!][!-Time: 1024556477-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST2004]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:g_blucher@yahoo.com"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Blucher[!-/Name-!][/a] on Thursday, June 20, 2002 - 12:01 am:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] Don't be too discouraged.  Imp. Yaga has a bug/conflict that sometimes causes a crash.  Not sure but I think the conflict is with the Imp. Gromnir.  When it happened to me (and it happened all of the time), I just reinstalled Imp. Yaga and reloaded an earier save and had no problems or crashes.
 
Nowadays, I install Imp. Gromnir before Yaga.
 
Um... technically, I use the WeiDU patches included in the WeiDU-Ascension, so I'm not sure if there are any problems with it as I've yet to play a game into ToB since the newer WeiDU mods came out.
 
Are you using the original Imp. Yaga or the WeiDU-Ascension Imp. Yaga? [!-/Text-!] [p]

[!-/Post: 2004-!]
[!-Post: 2010-!][!-Time: 1024592467-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST2010]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="javascript:alert('The e-mail address and profile information for the individual posting this message is not available.')" onMouseOver="window.status = 'The e-mail address and profile information for the individual posting this message is not available.'; return true"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Kiki[!-/Name-!][/a] on Thursday, June 20, 2002 - 10:01 am:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] I'm using WeiDU Ascension. But there's a warning in the readme about big battles that require more than the minimum specs, and I wouldn't be surprised if all I've got is the minimum. I need a new computer.
 
It's too bad because Improved Yaga-Shura was a lot of fun up to the point when my computer quit. Improved Gromnir and Illasera ran fine, but there weren't 3000 enemies on the screen, either. [!-/Text-!] [p]

[!-/Post: 2010-!]
[!-Post: 2077-!][!-Time: 1025394989-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST2077]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:weimer@cs.berkeley.edu"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Westley Weimer (Admin)[!-/Name-!][/a] on Saturday, June 29, 2002 - 04:56 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] I have added Volo/MasterWraith comments to the TODO list. [!-/Text-!] [p]
[!-/Post: 2077-!]
[!-Post: 2175-!][!-Time: 1025759456-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST2175]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="javascript:alert('The e-mail address and profile information for the individual posting this message is not available.')" onMouseOver="window.status = 'The e-mail address and profile information for the individual posting this message is not available.'; return true"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Soon_TB_Uber[!-/Name-!][/a] on Wednesday, July 03, 2002 - 10:10 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] Hmm.... the Phaere coming back to life to 'haunt' Solaufein would be in my opinion a good thing to add to an already excellent romance! You could have it revealed that since Pheare was killed by a demon... she had been sent to hell and had been tortured by this same demon, escaping from him much in the way Sarevok had in ToB into the Pocket Plane. You could then have the demon follow Pheare into the Plane (along with minions if you want) to reclaim her and Solaufein of course could go to the rescue....ack, (sheepish)I have an overactive imagination.....no more outa me! ^_~ [!-/Text-!] [p]

[!-/Post: 2175-!]
[!-Post: 2215-!][!-Time: 1026083371-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST2215]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="javascript:alert('The e-mail address and profile information for the individual posting this message is not available.')" onMouseOver="window.status = 'The e-mail address and profile information for the individual posting this message is not available.'; return true"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Aubrey[!-/Name-!][/a] on Sunday, July 07, 2002 - 04:09 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] Solaufein got the Moonray special ability and some ...extra spells? I'm not sure about the last one though.
 
Okay, he declared his loyalty and love just before going after Irenicus. Question: is this the end of the romance? Or there is more in ToB? Does anyone know?
 
TIA
 
 
Cheers [!-/Text-!] [p]

[!-/Post: 2215-!]
[!-Post: 2219-!][!-Time: 1026087071-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST2219]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:weimer@cs.berkeley.edu"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Westley Weimer (Admin)[!-/Name-!][/a] on Sunday, July 07, 2002 - 05:11 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] Currently, the last part of the romance is where he talks to you about children after you've (possibly) slept with him.  
 
You can still look forward to the Eclipse Party in ToB, however. :-)  
 
Good luck with the Moonray (yes, it comes with the "lunar spell memorization" bonus of two spells per level) -- it seems that most people get the Sword. Looks like you gave some altruistic answers. The Moonray powers aren't explicitly described, so you may have to experiment a bit to see how it works. [!-/Text-!] [p]

[!-/Post: 2219-!]
[!-Post: 2223-!][!-Time: 1026118652-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST2223]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="javascript:alert('The e-mail address and profile information for the individual posting this message is not available.')" onMouseOver="window.status = 'The e-mail address and profile information for the individual posting this message is not available.'; return true"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Aubrey[!-/Name-!][/a] on Monday, July 08, 2002 - 01:57 am:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] ]Currently, the last part of the romance is where ]he talks to you about children after you've (possibly) slept with him.  
 
He never asked me to sleep with him!! The last I heard from him was when he received his Goddess gift, and the only conversation about children so far has been concerning if I'd let my child to burn his hand, or something of the sort. Sorry, I don't remember exactly the line. Anyway, this has been before going to the woods at night.
 
Now we are in Saradush and he hasn't said a single word. Is he going to tell more or not? *confused*
 
 
]Looks like you gave some altruistic answers.  
 
What else could my She-Undead Hunter do? A Paladin is always a compassionate person. :-)
 
Question: if I my pc character changes class (thinking of a Berserker dual classed to Cleric, and alignment change from Lawful Good to Neutral Good) will this affect the romance with Solaufein, or anything else in the Sola mod?
 
Anyway. Solaufein romance, and the whole mod as well, has been the more mature and fulfilling so far. Thank you very much for this great work!!  
 
Cheers [!-/Text-!] [p]

[!-/Post: 2223-!]
[!-Post: 2230-!][!-Time: 1026146541-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST2230]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:weimer@cs.berkeley.edu"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Westley Weimer (Admin)[!-/Name-!][/a] on Monday, July 08, 2002 - 09:42 am:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!][font SIZE="-2"][font COLOR="0000ff"]He never asked me to sleep with him!! The last I heard from him was when he received his Goddess gift, and the only conversation about children so far has been concerning if I'd let my child to burn his hand, or something of the sort. Sorry, I don't remember exactly the line. Anyway, this has been before going to the woods at night. [/font][/font]
 
Hmm. Well, you have to be outdoors (not in a city/dungeon) at night with no non-party members around for him to try to ingratiate himself into your sleeping bag.  
 
I think neither the pocket plane nor Saradush qualifies as "outdoors, not a city, not a dungeon".   Keep going.  
 
[font SIZE="-2"][font COLOR="0000ff"]Question: if I my pc character changes class (thinking of a Berserker dual classed to Cleric, and alignment change from Lawful Good to Neutral Good) will this affect the romance with Solaufein, or anything else in the Sola mod? [/font][/font]
 
No.
 
[ If you hack Sola to change his class, he may not be able to use the Moonblade. But since you don't have it and you're not talking about him, that's fine. ]  
 
Have fun![!-/Text-!] [p]

[!-/Post: 2230-!]
[!-Post: 2232-!][!-Time: 1026148874-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST2232]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="javascript:alert('The e-mail address and profile information for the individual posting this message is not available.')" onMouseOver="window.status = 'The e-mail address and profile information for the individual posting this message is not available.'; return true"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Aubrey[!-/Name-!][/a] on Monday, July 08, 2002 - 10:21 am:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] Thank you very much, Weimer! I'll certainly have fun, if I survive Eclipse party that is. (FWIW, a guy I regard a sort of veteran to BG (met in Gamebanshee forums)who seems to know awfully many tactics, he admitted to have a veeeery serious problem beating the party. So, I'll do my best but I'm not very optimistic...)
 
Are there any thoughts on expanding Solaufein's dialogues or giving him a "voice" or whatever?
 
Thanks, again!
 
Aubrey [!-/Text-!] [p]

[!-/Post: 2232-!]
[!-Post: 2233-!][!-Time: 1026150611-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST2233]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:weimer@cs.berkeley.edu"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Westley Weimer (Admin)[!-/Name-!][/a] on Monday, July 08, 2002 - 10:50 am:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!][font SIZE="-2"][font COLOR="0000ff"]Are there any thoughts on expanding Solaufein's dialogues or giving him a "voice" or whatever?[/font][/font]
 
Yep. There's a big todo list of things to add to Sola (more SoA interaction, chats with the MAster Wraith in ToB, etc.) and people have offered to record voice-overs for him.  
 
It's mostly a lack of time on my part. :-([!-/Text-!] [p]

[!-/Post: 2233-!]
[!-Post: 2235-!][!-Time: 1026152350-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST2235]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="javascript:alert('The e-mail address and profile information for the individual posting this message is not available.')" onMouseOver="window.status = 'The e-mail address and profile information for the individual posting this message is not available.'; return true"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Aubrey[!-/Name-!][/a] on Monday, July 08, 2002 - 11:19 am:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] Weimer,
 
I read in another thread that you are thinking of writing an epilogue for ToB where Sola falls out of love with the pc.  
 
I think this would be unfair for the ladies. In many aspects you have created an intellectual, noble and much loveable guy -- which led many ladies, Anomen's ex-fans, to admit that, Yes, Sola is my type.  I'm wondering, then, why would you want to break their hearts? ;-) Isn't real life cruel enough? Hey, games are for fun and pleasure, not for crying over lost loves!
 
And that's the reason, I believe, why your idea seems to be so "unpopular". Think it about.
 
Just my two eurocents.
 
Cheers [!-/Text-!] [p]

[!-/Post: 2235-!]
[!-Post: 2236-!][!-Time: 1026153090-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST2236]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:weimer@cs.berkeley.edu"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Westley Weimer (Admin)[!-/Name-!][/a] on Monday, July 08, 2002 - 11:31 am:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!][font SIZE="-2"][font COLOR="0000ff"]I think this would be unfair for the ladies.[/font][/font]
 
It would probably be "unfair" for the gents as well, but it might be a tad more realistic. However, I am also of the opinion that we can strive for higher aims in fantasy "literature" (and similar venues). Real life is cruel enough, as you say -- why celebrate that in a game where we're out to have fun?  
 
The thread you are reading is old, and the upshot was that I came to the same conclusion you're advancing here. Solaufein has 5 possible epilogues depending on your choices. None of them feature Solaufien falling out of love with the PC.[!-/Text-!] [p]

[!-/Post: 2236-!]
[!-Post: 2237-!][!-Time: 1026161413-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST2237]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="javascript:alert('The e-mail address and profile information for the individual posting this message is not available.')" onMouseOver="window.status = 'The e-mail address and profile information for the individual posting this message is not available.'; return true"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Aubrey[!-/Name-!][/a] on Monday, July 08, 2002 - 01:50 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] ]It would probably be "unfair" for the gents as well, but it might be a tad more realistic.
 
That's true, but who wants realism in a game's plot? Not me, that's for sure.:-)
 
]Real life is cruel enough, as you say -- why celebrate that in a game where we're out to have fun?  
 
Actually, we shouldn't celebrate cruelty --social or sentimental-- in real life either. But this is off topic.
 
]Solaufein has 5 possible epilogues depending on your choices.
 
Now, that's what I call "realistic romantism" (I know it's oxymoron). :-)
 
]None of them feature Solaufien falling out of love with the PC.  
 
Seriously now, should pc's choices have been somehow stupid or silly or whatever, he could. As *I* perceive Solaufein's character, he is far above average Joe. You expect Anomen to stay with you as far as you are sweet, and you hear his constant whinning, and accept to do a little of "baby-sitting". In other words, as long as you are a wife --because that's what Anomen seeks: a wife.
 
But Solaufein is a completely different story. He's an inquisitive mind, a bit of philoshopher, a bit of poet, a bit of fighter, a bit of everything. He's a cosmos, and this is his beauty. Such a man would stay with a woman (or another man, or whatever), if she was one of his kind: an equal.
 
Yet, when he says, "Hush now, X, you know I will travel with you to hell and back, if necessary. I would not desert you", you know he tells the truth.  Solaufein is an introvert person, he thinks a lot before he speaks. And such a person is trustworthy, because you know that he won't change his mind so easily.
 
 
Maybe I'm rambling here, maybe I'm right. Sometimes even writers themselves are not fully aware of their characters' true nature before they finish the book. :-)
 
Cheers [!-/Text-!] [p]

[!-/Post: 2237-!]
[!-Post: 2238-!][!-Time: 1026163622-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST2238]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:weimer@cs.berkeley.edu"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Westley Weimer (Admin)[!-/Name-!][/a] on Monday, July 08, 2002 - 02:27 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!][font SIZE="-2"][font COLOR="0000ff"]Seriously now, should pc's choices have been somehow stupid or silly or whatever, he could. As *I* perceive Solaufein's character, he is far above average Joe. [/font][/font]
 
You're not the only one to find Solaufein ... "smarter than the average bear", shall we say. Most people are concerned with his sword and sorcery prowess, however.  
 
If your character makes "stupid decisions" in the game (to a degree), Solaufein will "fall out of love with you" in that the romance will end. In that case the epilogue does not talk about Sola falling out of love -- that has already happened. Instead, it talks about what Sola does once the PC is gone.  
 
[font SIZE="-2"][font COLOR="0000ff"]Maybe I'm rambling here, maybe I'm right. [/font][/font]
 
Well, it's certainly on-topic for this board. You're also right, in my opinion.  
 
[font SIZE="-2"][font COLOR="0000ff"]Sometimes even writers themselves are not fully aware of their characters' true nature before they finish the book. :-) [/font][/font]
 
A number of literary analysis classes have lead me to that conclusion. :-)  
 
One of the reasons that I have not "fleshed out" the "romance ends badly" actions and dialogue is that most people never see them. It's rare that you download the Solaufein mod, have him as an NPC, string him along and then dump him. I try to put my effort into things that every player will see.  
 
Many people do download and use Solaufein but eschew the romance bit (e.g., "you must have misinterpreted our friendship, Solaufein"). But in such cases it's not really a "the romance ended badly" sort of deal -- it's more of a "it never got started". Some of the epilogues are well-suited to that situation.[!-/Text-!] [p]

[!-/Post: 2238-!]
[!-Post: 2242-!][!-Time: 1026199015-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST2242]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="javascript:alert('The e-mail address and profile information for the individual posting this message is not available.')" onMouseOver="window.status = 'The e-mail address and profile information for the individual posting this message is not available.'; return true"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Aubrey[!-/Name-!][/a] on Tuesday, July 09, 2002 - 12:16 am:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] ]But in such cases it's not really a "the romance ended badly" sort of deal -- it's more of a "it never got started".  
 
I suppose everyone understands that. When I wrote "he could", I was thinking of the dialogues to come, if any, and I rather meant some dialogue options which could make Solaufein to change his mind about the pc, and which would be not quite clear for the player to understand what she/he did wrong. For, when you are romantically involved with a NPC it means you are interested in the romance, you spend a little time to think the dialogues you have with him/her and your decisions are not exactly light-hearted and.
 
In the next paragraph, however, I rejected my own suggestions. For, by speaking the specific lines, Solaufein seems to have already made a serious decision about his own feelings for the pc and what he wants to do. And those decisions go back at the end of SoA -- at least for my game.
 
And that's the end of my "analysis" :-)
 
How long do you think it will take you to finish the rest of the Solaufein project? and taking into consideration the little time you spare? :-)
 
Cheers [!-/Text-!] [p]

[!-/Post: 2242-!]
[!-Post: 2665-!][!-Time: 1027460870-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST2665]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:tomythekid@t-online.de"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Lump[!-/Name-!][/a] on Tuesday, July 23, 2002 - 02:47 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!] Hi all, [img SRC="http://manju.cs.berkeley.edu/~weimer/discus/clipart/happy.gif" ALT=":)"]
Always at the begining: Sorry for my terrible english [img SRC="http://manju.cs.berkeley.edu/~weimer/discus/clipart/sad.gif" ALT=":("]
 
Is the Romance finished with the talk about childern?
He spoke about children with me, after that we had a romantic night together .... Thats all?
*ÄRGGLLTGTL*
Please .... NO [img SRC="http://manju.cs.berkeley.edu/~weimer/discus/clipart/sad.gif" ALT=":("]
Its really a wonderful Romance.
Even Anomen says a few words at TOB. Couldnt Solafein say some words in TOB, too?
 
Couldnt you please just write some "short" interactions for TOB? PLEASE ......
I dont want to play TOB (again) without having your really GREAT Sola-Mod implemented in it. [img SRC="http://manju.cs.berkeley.edu/~weimer/discus/clipart/sad.gif" ALT=":("]
 
There are some posibilitys:
- Having a child (if the players wants, little baby in the inventory [img SRC="http://manju.cs.berkeley.edu/~weimer/discus/clipart/happy.gif" ALT=":)"] With a child, they have a lot to speak. :D )
- Phaere is coming back
(but she is still evil and wants to trick Solaufein OR she is good and Solaufein have the possibility to choose between Player and Phaere.)
- Just some "Romantic Talk" (like Anomen with the flower in SOA)
- Talking about the future (where to live, what to do)
- Flirt Pack just like in the Kelsey Mod.
 
I tried the Kelsey MOD .... but .... [img SRC="http://manju.cs.berkeley.edu/~weimer/discus/clipart/sad.gif" ALT=":("] ... After having talked a bit with Solaufein: Kelsey is a bit to "soft" for my personal taste and he talk to much about his family, sorry. Is just my personal taste.
By the way: The Kelsey Mod is of course a GREAT Mod, too.
 
Westley, its a compliment, that so many people wants to read more "Solaufein Romance":
"A bit personality from the writer is always in his heros."
So, you are a bit Solaufein. So ... a lot of women and men just loves you ;)
 
 ... couldnt you write a book (a samll one of course) ;)
 
Greetings [img SRC="http://manju.cs.berkeley.edu/~weimer/discus/clipart/happy.gif" ALT=":)"]
and thanks again that you helped me so nice via mail (now: everything works fine). [!-/Text-!] [p]

[!-/Post: 2665-!]
[!-Post: 2667-!][!-Time: 1027464837-!]
[table BGCOLOR=#ccccff WIDTH=100% BORDER=1 BORDERCOLOR=#0000ff] [tr][td][font FACE="Verdana,Arial,Helvetica" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"][font SIZE=-1] [a NAME=POST2667]  By [!-Email-!][a HREF="mailto:weimer@cs.berkeley.edu"][!-/Email-!][!-Name-!]Westley Weimer (Admin)[!-/Name-!][/a] on Tuesday, July 23, 2002 - 03:53 pm:[/font][/td][/tr][/table][p] [!-Text-!][font SIZE="-2"][font COLOR="0000ff"]He spoke about children with me, after that we had a romantic night together .... Thats all? [/font][/font]
 
With the newest one there's another dialogue about black ravens. It takes a while to write this stuff. :-)  
 
[font SIZE="-2"][font COLOR="0000ff"]There are some posibilitys: [/font][/font]
 
Thanks for these. We'll definitely have Phaere visit with the Master Wraith.  
 
[font SIZE="-2"][font COLOR="0000ff"]So, you are a bit Solaufein. So ... a lot of women and men just loves you ;)[/font][/font]
 
You are too kind. I'm not as much fun in real life; I have a dual penchant for being judgmental and for having high standards.[!-/Text-!] [p]

[!-/Post: 2667-!]
[!-End-!]                    

Jesara

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Romance Conclusion
« Reply #1 on: July 23, 2002, 09:54:33 PM »
Oo nice to see one of my favorites here.  I'm Jes in this thread. ;)  And I'm eagerly waiting more Solaufein.                    

Lump

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Romance Conclusion
« Reply #2 on: July 24, 2002, 04:44:03 PM »
Would be fine, if there where some "talk" with Solaufein, whitch start only in TOB. So it cant happend, that somebody finished the Mod in SOA.

Like I say before: Bit more Romantic - Talk with Solaufein would be nice.

Of course, I understand Westley: He just want to write for as many people as possible - but .... the Solaufein Mod is a "Solaufein Romance" - not a "Solaufein Friendship" - hope you unterstand what I want to say .... :blink:

.... there are some girls (and boys) out there :) who loves Solaufein. And they want to flirt with him a bit :D

What makes Solaufein special: The mix between small quests, philosophical discussions and bit "romantic flirt". The quality of the text is high (after my opinion).
Playing Solaufein Mod is just like: Reading a good Fantasy book.



Steffi, is it you? Bist du das Steffi?

                   

Aubrey

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Romance Conclusion
« Reply #3 on: July 26, 2002, 12:12:20 PM »
Someone back at the old discussion board among his/her suggestions for ToB had mentioned the possibility of Solaufein and Pc having a child. I'm copying:
Quote
There are some posibilitys:
- Having a child (if the players wants, little baby in the inventory  With a child, they have a lot to speak.  )

I hate to disappoint people, but if we re-read Solaufein's view on the matter, this is not an option. I'm quoting part of the dialogue:

(PC), do you think that adventures with lives as dangerous as ours could ever settle down and have children? [...] I ask because most adventurers eventually settle down to raise a family. Many initially struggle for glory and honor, only to belatedly discover that lasting happiness was never far from home and hearth. [...] I am not such a person. Any child of mine would be slaughtered wholesale by my fellow Drow and probably treated little better by prejudiced surfacers. I cannot find it within myself to bring a child into a society where that sort of reaction awaits.

Now, if PC protest, we'll hear Solaufein's final words on the subject:
 
 I do not believe the time is yet right for me to guide a child through this world. I would rather spare children much of the pain I have felt.

With all due respect, I thought to post it so as we all understand that this possibility is not... a possibility. Apart from the very words of Solaufein himself, I would dare to say that parenthood doesn't seem to fit him well.  :)

Cheers                    

Offline jcompton

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« Reply #4 on: July 26, 2002, 12:48:56 PM »
Quote
I hate to disappoint people, but if we re-read Solaufein's view on the matter, this is not an option. I'm quoting part of the dialogue:

With all due respect, I thought to post it so as we all understand that this possibility is not... a possibility.
                   Hmmm. Presuming that Solaufein and the PC are sleeping together, and the PC is female, it's not entirely up to Solaufein, I wouldn't say...

Of course, we know and accept that the "Weimerfein" is nearly omnipotent and Eilistraee is his penpal, but unless he's got some special ability we're unaware of... never say never. I'm sure whatever Jaheira or Cernd can hook them up with is a little less reliable than Ortho-tricyclen.                    
Cespenar says, "Kelsey and friends be at the Pocket Plane? Ohhh yesssss!" http://www.pocketplane.net

alustriel

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Romance Conclusion
« Reply #5 on: July 26, 2002, 01:14:09 PM »
I have to agree in this case.  It's not Sola's decision in the end.  Things happen, for good or bad, and you deal with it.  Does this mean Sola would stick around to care for the child?  Given his hesitancy to bring a child into the world, he might not.  He's said many times in his various LT's and banters that he prefers travelling and learning.  Not home and hearth as you said.  But if the pc expresses an interest in having a child... well then... Sola shouldn't be sleeping with her in the first place to prevent such a thing from happening!  Just common sense.

                   



[!--EDIT|alustriel|Jul 26 2002, 01:14 PM--]

Aubrey

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Romance Conclusion
« Reply #6 on: July 26, 2002, 03:32:16 PM »
Do you think that Solaufein, and as we know him so far, makes a good (I don't say perfect) candidate for elaborating in such an issue? I don't.

However, alustriel has a point here: if pc is a female and is of a different opinion on the children subject, Solaufein shouldn't sleep with her. But then, it would be a "lame" case. ;)

On the other hand, there is always Kelsey: a sweet-heart dreaming to settle down, etc; she could choose him over Solaufein, and have as many children as she likes.  :D

Quote
but unless he's got some special ability we're unaware of... never say never.

 :lol:  :lol:  :lol:                    



[!--EDIT|Aubrey|Jul 27 2002, 12:34 AM--]

reiella

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Romance Conclusion
« Reply #7 on: July 26, 2002, 03:38:12 PM »
Not quite true.

With the lovely psuedo-modern nature of the Realms, there is in fact 100% effective birth control for both men and women.

For men it's the Cassil herb which renders them infertile for 3d4 days (and typically is a tasteless powder when used).

For women it's the licorlice flavored Nararoot herb which has different time lengthes depending on how it's used.  Shavings steeped in hot water make a tea that's d4+2 days.  Chewed raw it tastes unpleasant but lasts 2d4+4 days.                    

Aubrey

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« Reply #8 on: July 26, 2002, 03:59:22 PM »
Now, this is very interesting! I hadn't had the smallest idea about it.

Thank you, reiella, for the info.  :)


Cheers                    

Lump

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Romance Conclusion
« Reply #9 on: July 27, 2002, 10:14:01 PM »
Always at the beginning: Sorry, for my terrible english :)  :ph34r:


Every Player should decide for himself / herself, if Sola and the Character should have a child or not!!

A dialouge at the beginning:
Character:
a. Solaufein, I just want to say that I love you / we should kill more Orcs .... bla....bla...bla  (Player dont want to have a child)
b. Solaufein, I must tell you: Im pregnant ... bla bla bla ...(Player want to have a child)

My opinion: Dont FORCE people to do something. Don't force the player to have a child BUT also - dont "kill the fun" for some players, if they want a baby with Solaufein.
If you dont want to have a baby with Sola, if you dont like the idea - dont do it. But why forcing others to be the same meaning like you????
All arguments FOR the baby are allright but also all arguments against the baby are all right.
I really don't see a problem here ......

By the way, not all arguments again the baby-idea are all right:
Example in reality: A friend of mine (a man) told me:
"I dont wanted to have a baby, even not when my girl-friend was pregnant. BUT: When my daughter was born and I had her in my arms, for the first time, I chanced my opition - not only about babys."

Solaufein is a VERY good Mod  - this have different reasons. One of it: Solaufein chances his opinions, he learn, he think - he seem to be a "living, thinking being". I had the idea with the baby (probebly like some other people) when Sola told my Charakter that he DONT want to have children.
I thought: Hey, could be fun, if my Charakter would chance his opinion on this. :)


And ... NOT everybody like Kelsey. Me for example ... I think the Kelsey Mod is great, BUT I dont like this boy. Solaufein is a bit like a "very inteligent :) , black panther" (the animal) and (for me) Kelsey is like a .... rabbit (my personal taste). I know 2 other people who say the same about Kelsey (great Mod, but the boy ....). And I know one other girl who like Kelsey, but she LOVES Solaufein.


THE MOD
Its not my Mod, I dit not worked on it, I even dont know this Mod for a long time (or Westley) nevertheless Im proud of this Mod. Im a bit ambitious: I want that this Romance should be the best of all. And a Romance without the posibility to have a baby ...... its a bit like a beach without sea. :)


IDEAS TO THE BABY
A baby would give some possibilitys for a few nice talks with Sola and for a nice Mini-Quest (somebody steals the baby).

The “big problem” with the baby was (and still is): How can the mother be on aventure, if she is pregnant (and with a baby in the bagage)? Most of the people solve this problem with: The baby comes very late – in TOB.
WHY? TOB isnt AS long …. And it is not very logical that you just make a little break for about ONE year to have a baby – in this war times.

Idea: When could a Charakter make a longer break in SoA / TOB?
In the elven-town in Suldanessalar. So the MainCharakter could have a baby in this time (if the player wants).
Problem: The confession to Sola should be: After leaving the hell. But I don’t know if there is a technical possibility to interrupt the little film with the elven queen with a Sola diskussion ……..
Diskussion could be like:
1. I just wanted to say that I love you bla bla bla bla …… (don’t want to be pregnant)
2. Hi dear, im pregnant …. Bla bla bla    (HEY, Westley is the writer / author, not me :)  )

What would be very cool: If there where a possibility to have a chance of 40 % to have a boy, 40 % a girl an 10 % twins :-) So the people don’t have every time the “same childs”:
Hey, what do you have? I have a girl – Oh, I have twins – Yes? Great, girl and boy? – Yes ...... and so on …….
I don’t think that it is possible, to choose for your own the name of the babys. Would be cool … but … technical…..???

AND there could be a nice, little quest when somebody steal the baby(s) and the group try to get it back.


Greetings to all
 :)                    



[!--EDIT|Lump|Jul 28 2002, 05:18 AM--]

Aubrey

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« Reply #10 on: July 28, 2002, 02:12:51 AM »
Quote
I want that this Romance should be the best of all. And a Romance without the posibility to have a baby ...... its a bit like a beach without sea.

There have been a lot of people who enjoy love, companionship, etc., without having a baby. They don't have a strong feeling for babies, and their "romance" is definitely a beach with sea to them.

Okay, you are talking about possibilities, and one possibility would be pc having a baby with Solaufein. BUT if Solaufein is taking Cassil herb wouldn't be so easy for the pc to get pregnant in a first place. Let's don't forget that men who are strongly opposed to have children, they usually do whatever they can to prevent it from happening.


Quote
And ... NOT everybody like Kelsey. Me for example ... I think the Kelsey Mod is great, BUT I dont like this boy. Solaufein is a bit like a "very inteligent  , black panther" (the animal) and (for me) Kelsey is like a .... rabbit (my personal taste). I know 2 other people who say the same about Kelsey (great Mod, but the boy ....). And I know one other girl who like Kelsey, but she LOVES Solaufein.

Kelsey is a sweet-heart. He might be a little insecure, be a less "dominant" personality compared to Solaufein, but this doesn't mean we could describing him as a ...rabbit?!

The only problem I see with Kelsey's character is his easiness to move from one romance to another (his excuses about sleeping with women in caravans just for warming the night didn't convince me). He gives the impression he is incapable of falling in *real* love with a single person forever. I know, life goes on, but still. How one is supposed to believe in the genuineness of his feelings when he's not a bit selective?

Just my thoughts


Cheers                    



[!--EDIT|Aubrey|Jul 28 2002, 11:14 AM--]

Offline jcompton

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« Reply #11 on: July 28, 2002, 12:14:38 PM »
Quote
The only problem I see with Kelsey's character is his easiness to move from one romance to another (his excuses about sleeping with women in caravans just for warming the night didn't convince me). He gives the impression he is incapable of falling in *real* love with a single person forever. I know, life goes on, but still. How one is supposed to believe in the genuineness of his feelings when he's not a bit selective?
                   Hmmm. Well, let me know what you think on this issue after you play Kelsey-TOB. But until then--is it Kelsey's fault that nobody as special as [CHARNAME] has come along in his life yet? :)                    
Cespenar says, "Kelsey and friends be at the Pocket Plane? Ohhh yesssss!" http://www.pocketplane.net

Lump

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« Reply #12 on: July 28, 2002, 01:20:35 PM »
@Aubrey
(My english is not very good - Im not angry or want to hurt you, hope my following words dont make the impression :)  )


You said:
“There have been a lot of people who enjoy love, companionship, etc., without having a baby. They don't have a strong feeling for babies, and their "romance" is definitely a beach with sea to them.”

No problem – nobody will force them to have a baby!

You said:
“BUT if Solaufein is taking Cassil herb wouldn't be so easy for the pc to get pregnant in a first place. Let's don't forget that men who are strongly opposed to have children, they usually do whatever they can to prevent it from happening.”

You argument with logic when we are talking about SEX? I mean: Sex & passion!! And you say: He will take some herbs…….
- Its not so easy for elves in D&D to become pregnant. They live long and they don’t become so often and quickly pregnant. Solaufein is a drow – a dark elf – SO: It can happen that he forget the herbs, cause they are not so important for elves in D&D!!
- He take old herbs – there are thousend possibilitys how it could happened!
MY character have a charisma of 20 – how long will Sola resist if she really wants to make him hot. ;-)

Dit you ever made a boy in reality REALLY hot? I have done it a few times – some of them …. I would say … they had even problems to remember their names at this moment – not talking about “herbs”. (by the way: its really shit, to sleep with somebody without protection)
:-D and I DON’T have charimsa 20 in reality.

I still say: Its you're opinion - and I respect it - cause I Say: Never force somebody to something they don’t want.
But YOU don’t respect that others want to have a baby. Its not YOU'RE Solaufein. Other people have other opinions and a other view of him.
(sorry, sorry, sounds hart, don’t mean it hard. Can’t express it better.)

Why are you so “wild” to convince the people? I’m wild to convince everybody, cause I could win A LOT: Some new dialogues with Sola, some fine quest, a (for me) great event (baby). What do you win? That others don’t have the fun they wishes to have?
For some a baby is not important in a Romance. For others its VERY important …. Different opinions! One solution: Both is possible, let every  player choose his own way!

I say it again: Nobody forces the player to have a baby. It’s the decision of everybody.
The solution would be good and fine for every player.

Greetings
:)


*SPOILER*
...
...
...
...
...

PS:
By the way: Solaufein chances his opinion about babys LATER. If the character decides to stay human / elfish / whatever Solaufein and the character have a girl - later! Means: He chances his opinion about this - later! Why not earlyer?

                   



[!--EDIT|Lump|Jul 29 2002, 12:17 AM--]

Aubrey

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Romance Conclusion
« Reply #13 on: July 29, 2002, 01:59:45 AM »
@jcompton --

Quote
Hmmm. Well, let me know what you think on this issue after you play Kelsey-TOB. But until then--is it Kelsey's fault that nobody as special as has come along in his life yet?

No, it's not his fault. BUT, is he supposed to go around and achieve intimacy with *every* female he meets until he finds this special one? He gives the impression of lacking somehow in perception and judgement. Anyway. I will let you know when I finish the game. And I still believe he's a sweet-heart.  :)

 @Lump --

Quote
Its you're opinion - and I respect it - cause I Say: Never force somebody to something they don’t want. But YOU don’t respect that others want to have a baby. Its not YOU'RE Solaufein. Other people have other opinions and a other view of him.

I do respect another's opinion even if it is opposite to mine. But when there is a conflict of opinions one should give some reasons to support his/her argument. That's what I do, and... isn't it what you do as well?

Quote
Why are you so “wild” to convince the people? I’m wild to convince everybody, cause I could win A LOT: Some new dialogues with Sola, some fine quest, a (for me) great event (baby). What do you win? That others don’t have the fun they wishes to have?

I'm not trying to convince anyone; I'm just expressing my views on the child issue taking into consideration Solaufein's character as it appears to be up to now. There is nothing for me in it, save for my wish of a fair consistency.

When Solaufein states all his reasons for not wanting a baby, it would be ridiculous after a chapter or two to have him showing acceptance and joy in the even of an expectant pc. Maybe Solaufein's character seem a bit flat on the issue in question, but by making a U turn there is a possibility of turning him into a caricature rather than a round character.

Should, however, Weimer decides to make some changes in Solaufein's character during ToB in order to justify the birth of a child in-game, these changes should be convincing and originate in an important event.


Cheers                    



[!--EDIT|Aubrey|Jul 29 2002, 11:02 AM--]

Lump

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Romance Conclusion
« Reply #14 on: July 29, 2002, 03:12:40 AM »
*SPOILER*

....
....
....
....

But some day he makes a U turn - see the end (if the charakter stays with him). SO: Its sure that he will make a U turn and that he will have a child and that he will love this child and that he is very proud and happy with it.

The question is NOT: Will he have a baby OR want he to have a baby. Cause this question is answerd: he will / he want - look at the end.

The only question is: When will this (U-Turn & baby) happen? Now or in some years ....

....
....
....

*SPOILERS END*

Like a girl here say it before - in a other post: Babys can happen! Its not always a "wished" baby: Even if you "protect yourself".

My impression was: He loves children & he want to have children, but he is frightend that somebody could hurt them. He say that he dont want - but  look like he is talking about kids ...... I dont know a lot of men who are talking about children like this.
Only a man who loves & want children talk like this ....

So: He want to have, but he is frigthend to have (he is frightend that he could not protect them - his own words).
What happend when he see that he is strong enough to kill dragons and demons alone?


Hehehehe, probebly Westley wrote just something down - what was "traveling" in his head (*ärgs* english is really hard sometimes - I say it in german, too: "Er schrieb einfach nieder, was ihm gerade so durch den Kopf ging.")
And look at us :) we are talking about Solaufeins Words like about Nietsches :)
But I like it :)

Thanks ... hope we will continue this a bit  :)
(its not a stupid joke - i mean it serious. I love discussions like this.)                    



[!--EDIT|Lump|Jul 29 2002, 10:15 AM--]

Kish

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Romance Conclusion
« Reply #15 on: July 29, 2002, 07:32:21 AM »
I can think of one immediate problem with Solaufein having an unplanned baby:

It's not gender-neutral.  The baby in that one Solaufein epilogue results from divine intervention.  The Solaufein romance is not, currently, a romance that works better for females than males, nor do I think it should be.  I'm all for a conversation that goes differently based on gender, because it would make Solaufein actually feel bisexual, rather than feeling like a computer program that doesn't check gender--but adding an entire subplot that only one gender gets to see would make it feel more like he's a female-specific romance with the ability to have a limited degree of romance with males tacked on as an afterthought.                    

Lump

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Romance Conclusion
« Reply #16 on: July 29, 2002, 02:29:07 PM »
But its still you're descision if you have a child.
If you play a man its YOU'RE own descision if you want to be as unrealistic to have a child with a other man or not  B)

I know only 4  homosexuell boys - but 2 of them have a real big problem: They have a long, good realtionsship and they want a baby. Look at the television: Adoption from children through homoseuell couples is often a theme. And a lot homosexuell are frustrated cause they cant have one (or dont see a possibility to get one).

You are talking here always about: Its not logical, he would not do, its strange ....

You forget one think: This is a game. IT DONT HAVE TO BE LOGICAL   :)  everywhere / everytime!
The only think a game should do is: Making fun .... and  for some people a bit more: satisfy some unrealizable dreams.

So I turn you're argument "a bit" against you: It could be especially for SOME (not all) homosexuell people a great deal to have the posibility to have a baby with a nother man. Its unrealistic, its impossible? WHO CARES?
Still: Nobody forces you!
I copuld imagine that the 2 homoseuell boys I know (if they would play BG, the dont :( ) - they would feel a bit like in heaven: A Mod where they can finally realise a dream.

Its also unrealistic that you have a romance with Solaufein AND Anomen. WHO cares?

*kruschtel* *kruschtel* *dictionary* :D


The only think thats important at this mod: Make fun & dont hurt somebody.

Just at all: Its not an argument. When you come to the End of TOB you will see one think: The charakter IS a women!!! Look at the spoiler in my last message! So - I dont understand you're argument ....????


PS: The german Solaufein translation is writen for women, Solaufein says always: My girl-friend (meine Freundin), my female-love (meine Liebste).  


Greetings  :)                    



[!--EDIT|Lump|Jul 29 2002, 09:46 PM--]

Kish

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« Reply #17 on: July 29, 2002, 03:05:38 PM »
Quote
You forget one think: This is a game. IT DONT HAVE TO BE LOGICAL smile.gif everywhere / everytime!
The only think a game should do is: Making fun ....

Throwing logic out the window is not conducive to fun for everyone.                    

Kish

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Romance Conclusion
« Reply #18 on: July 29, 2002, 03:06:46 PM »
Quote
Just at all: Its not an argument. When you come to the End of TOB you will see one think: The charakter IS a women!!! Look at the spoiler in my last message!
No.  Solaufein and CharName are sent a child by divine intervention in that one epilogue.  (Which only applies if Solaufein got the Moonray and CharName stayed mortal.)  It does not say, or even imply, that the main character is a woman.

Quote
PS: The german Solaufein translation is writen for women, Solaufein says always: My girl-friend (meine Freundin), my female-love (meine Liebste).
Now that is something that truly deserves a "who cares?"  I wonder if Wes realized that.  I wonder if it's even possible to write gender-neutral romance terminology in German. : shrug: Either way--it is a translation, and apparently a much less than perfect one.                    

Offline jcompton

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« Reply #19 on: July 29, 2002, 03:41:58 PM »
Quote
Now that is something that truly deserves a "who cares?"  I wonder if Wes realized that.  I wonder if it's even possible to write gender-neutral romance terminology in German. : shrug: Either way--it is a translation, and apparently a much less than perfect one.
                   But that is an interesting point that Wes should perhaps be aware of.                    
Cespenar says, "Kelsey and friends be at the Pocket Plane? Ohhh yesssss!" http://www.pocketplane.net

Aubrey

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« Reply #20 on: July 29, 2002, 04:10:39 PM »
@Kish --

Quote
I wonder if Wes realized that. I wonder if it's even possible to write gender-neutral romance terminology in German. : shrug: Either way--it is a translation, and apparently a much less than perfect one.

1) I think it isn't possible to write a gender-neutral romance in German language. My rough guess is the formation of word endings, both in nouns and adjectives, specifying gender as it is in Italian, French, Greek, Spanish, etc., as it is the case with articles as well.

2) I believe Weimer would probably know about the translation. What more logical than having talked about it with the friend who worked on it?

3) I agree that original texts have a sort of beauty translations lack. BUT, if you haven't read the translation, haven't make a comparison to the original and haven't some knowledge in the subject in order to support your argument, then it's at least unfair to express such an opinion on a person's translating work.


@Lump --

Quote
Its also unrealistic that you have a romance with Solaufein AND Anomen. WHO cares?

No, it's not unrealistic. Don't you read magazines? newspapers? People are splitting up everyday because of this kind of affairs.  Sorry, but this is the most realistic part, if I may.

Unrealistic would be if Solaufein and his boyfriend get a child. Who would play the part of the mother during the pregnancy stage? Solaufein or his boyfriend?  [_[

(Unless, of course, drows have this ultra-extra-special ability.)


Cheers

                   

Kish

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Romance Conclusion
« Reply #21 on: July 29, 2002, 04:14:11 PM »
Quote
3) I agree that original texts have a sort of beauty translations lack. BUT, if you haven't read the translation, haven't make a comparison to the original and haven't some knowledge in the subject in order to support your argument, then it's at least unfair to express such an opinion on a person's translating work.
I know that, apparently, the German translation is not gender-neutral.  That's enough to make it a flawed translation.  Perhaps necessarily so...but, still, flawed.                    

Aubrey

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Romance Conclusion
« Reply #22 on: July 29, 2002, 04:24:32 PM »
How much of a flaw can be a language's structure, syntaxis, grammar, and all these rules a language is consisted of?

No, I don't think it's a flaw, but rather the way languages work in their environment.  That's why there are cases where some phrases or words in a text are called "untranslatable".


Cheers                    

Lump

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Romance Conclusion
« Reply #23 on: July 29, 2002, 06:10:26 PM »
Somehow I have the impression you dont unterstand me :(
Try to explain it on a other way:

There are a lot of people who are playing this Mod. We are not the only ones. And all this people have different opinions and see Solaufein in a other .... have different views over Solaufein.

Group1:"A baby would be unrealistic. Solaufein dont want - we should not force him."
Group2:"We just dont want a baby. Must this little bugs be everywhere?" :D
Group3: "Without a baby a romance is not a "real" romance. I miss something without this possibility." (thats me :P )
Group4: "They must have a baby, cause Solaufein is just to frightend to confess that he want to have a baby, the charakter must "force" him."
Group5: "However - im not interest in this discussion." :)

I wrote down here just a few groups - BUT - and there are lot of more groups and opinions. You are just ONE of this groups (or two). Im just one of this group.
And our opinions - in this case - are ALL right! ALL! Cause our opinions here are based on views. And views can be different.

EVERY group want to see: How Westley realize there opinions / there ideas.
What to do now?

I say: Try to find a solution that makes EVERY group happy - if this is possible. Is it possible? YES!
You just create 2 ways for Solaufein: One way with a baby and one way without a baby.  Finished.

If you create something, than you want that a lot of people use it, like it, LOVE IT. As "creator" you must find a way between:
- Realize the own introductions
AND
- Making as many fans happy as possible.

AS MANY AS POSSIBLE! You're arguments again a baby are good, are truth -BUT - my arguments for a baby are all right, too.
But we / you are just a few fans - there are others.
And so, Westley can find a way (only IF HE WANT - poor Westley :blink: i think we make him crazy :) ) who makes ALL FANS happy, not just me / you.

My example / my idea:
At the end of SoA or at the beginning of TOB - you have the choice, what you say:

a. "Solaufein, im going to the fontaine, come with me and lets talk a bit about ..... puhhh ...... monster killing / philosophy ....."
b. "Im pregnant, we will have a baby, Solaufein ......."

You have the choice between a. OR b.
If you dont like the baby idea - choice a. and you will never talk again about babys and children with Solaufein.

And Westley could (now im sure he will hate me :) ) write for the non-baby-"way / choice" some nice extra talks. That the baby-people dont have.
This solution would enlarge the fun to play the Solaufein Mod a second time - for some people - with and without the baby.




@ Kish:

You worry about, that the Solaufein Mod could make  the impression it is only for women (with the possibility of having a baby)? Thats really an ..... what impression the people have when they play the normal BG2 & TOB Romances without Mods?
And even if this impression "happend" - you dont want that some people feel worse - cause they have the impression the romance is only for women. BUT - what about the people who feel worse cause THERE ARE NO possibility to have a baby???
This argument is a bit ... in Germany you say: "An den Haaren herbeigezogen." - Searching for arguments.

You said: "The baby in that one Solaufein epilogue results from divine intervention."
Hmmm, so its all right if this female godness "surprise" Solaufein with a baby - but its not all right if my charakter do this???

You said: "Now that is something that truly deserves a "who cares?" I wonder if Wes realized that. I wonder if it's even possible to write gender-neutral romance terminology in German. : shrug: Either way--it is a translation, and apparently a much less than perfect one. "

:angry:
YES, I feel attacked when I read something like this.

:angry:
The german translation is GOOD!! Its HARD work to translate something like this and the german transaltor (Falk??) have done a great work.



@Aubrey

Me: "Its also unrealistic that you have a romance with Solaufein AND Anomen. WHO cares? "

You: "No, it's not unrealistic. Don't you read magazines? newspapers? People are splitting up everyday because of this kind of affairs. Sorry, but this is the most realistic part, if I may."

We have the same opinion this time. :)  :D  :)
But you see - I had a "hot" discussion with a girl from switzerland. She told me, that she thinks the Solaufein Mod is not good - the Kelsey Mod is mutch better (she loves Kelsey. By the way: A very good Mod).
Cause: The Solaufein Mod is unrealistic. She told me: A man like Anomen would NEVER accept a other man beside him. I told her: "Your opinion, not mine. But ... who cares?" :D She told me: I have the posibility to have both romances at the same time - and this is shit and so on and so on ... was really a HOT discussion.  :ph34r:

You see - bit the same like here. :)

You: "I do respect another's opinion even if it is opposite to mine. But when there is a conflict of opinions one should give some reasons to support his/her argument. That's what I do, and... isn't it what you do as well? "

Hmmmm - me english will never be better. Dint you want to learn perfectly german? :D I think we could have great discussion (NICE ones). But at the moment I have the impression that my non- english stands a bit between us :(

EDIT: I read all you're messages again - I hope I understand NOW:
You are NOT again the idea / possibility to have a baby. You are just saying that you will not use this option and why. Is this right?
                   



[!--EDIT|Lump|Jul 30 2002, 01:38 AM--]

reiella

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Romance Conclusion
« Reply #24 on: July 29, 2002, 06:43:57 PM »
It is kinda possible to write a gender neutral german translation, the downside is that it tends to come off as a tad bit insulting to use the gender neutral pronouns, especially in such a situation.                    

 

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