Author Topic: question about Keto's song in the bard competition  (Read 5867 times)

Offline Lemernis

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question about Keto's song in the bard competition
« on: May 02, 2009, 04:51:08 AM »
If Yoshimo joins the party, and he is with the party in Spellhold and dies at the PC's hands, does Keto sing about his life and death at the bard competition in Imnesvale?  I see suggestions of that in the TRA files but I'm not able to find the actual song...

I ask this because the mod Keeping Yoshimo allows the player to keep Yoshi alive, i.e., he doesn't die and sticks around until the end of ToB.  And if Yoshi's death per the vanilla storyline is integral to Keto's Chapter 6 quest, then the two mods are clearly incompatible. 

The only way I can envision the two mods ever becoming compatible is if the Keto mod checks for Yoshi's death variable in order for any and all conversations about his death to fire; and presumably Keto has an alternate song to perform in the event that Yoshimo's death variable is not found.  Keto must perform some other song if Yoshimo never joins the party to begin with, right? 

But I can also see that this would compromise a great amount of dialogue written around Yoshimo's death.  Also, Keto seems to form a fast frienship with Yoshimo that if the above 'fixes' were made would abruptly come to a halt after Spelllhold, with no explanation. 

So I fully expect KY and Keto to be (and most likely to remain) fundamentally incompatible.  But I figured I would put the suggestion out there as to how they might be reconciled if anyone still maintaining Keto has the interest/will to do it. 

(Heh, I guess I'll play devil's advocate for a moment on this:  I doubt that it would be particularly jarring for most players if the friendship between Keto and Yoshimo simply ceases after Spellhold.  Players would still be able to enjoy Keto in all her other dimensions.  And if Keeping Yoshimo is not installed along with Keto, then the mod would still work business as usual (again, assuming all conversations re: Yoshi's death are dependent on a check for his death variable).  I can appreciate not wanting to compromise something so integral to the character by eliminating material that is so important to Keto.  But if the above mentioned changes were made, for those who want the fullest possible Keto experience, then obviously they should not install Keeping Yoshimo along with Keto. ;) )
« Last Edit: May 02, 2009, 05:57:09 AM by Lemernis »

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Re: question about Keto's song in the bard competition
« Reply #1 on: June 12, 2009, 06:53:01 AM »
So what song does Keto sing if Yoshi never joins the party? Surely someone in this forum would know. Does the author of Keto post here still?

Offline jcompton

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Re: question about Keto's song in the bard competition
« Reply #2 on: June 12, 2009, 10:56:24 AM »
If Yoshimo joins the party, and he is with the party in Spellhold and dies at the PC's hands, does Keto sing about his life and death at the bard competition in Imnesvale?  I see suggestions of that in the TRA files but I'm not able to find the actual song...

Sorry for the late reply. There are four possible stories Keto tells as her contribution to the contest, based on things that have happened to her and (mostly) the recommendations of the PC. Keto can still win without the Yoshimo story.

Quote
I ask this because the mod Keeping Yoshimo allows the player to keep Yoshi alive, i.e., he doesn't die and sticks around until the end of ToB.  And if Yoshi's death per the vanilla storyline is integral to Keto's Chapter 6 quest, then the two mods are clearly incompatible. 

Technically the only thing we actually care about is whether or not Keto and Yoshimo got close to one another, based on them reaching a particular interaction. So she can still tell the story about Yoshimo even with such a mod installed, it just won't make as much sense, as she speaks of him in the past tense.

Quote
So I fully expect KY and Keto to be (and most likely to remain) fundamentally incompatible.  But I figured I would put the suggestion out there as to how they might be reconciled if anyone still maintaining Keto has the interest/will to do it. 

Incompatible from a story perspective, but not technologically incompatible. The game will not break. It is exceedingly unlikely that we will add any content to account for this other mod.
Cespenar says, "Kelsey and friends be at the Pocket Plane? Ohhh yesssss!" http://www.pocketplane.net

Offline jcompton

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Re: question about Keto's song in the bard competition
« Reply #3 on: June 12, 2009, 11:01:50 AM »
So what song does Keto sing if Yoshi never joins the party? Surely someone in this forum would know. Does the author of Keto post here still?

There are three other stories she can tell (she doesn't actually sing)--two are different versions of her own personal story, the third tells a story about the PC's abduction by Irenicus.

I've said it a number of times before, but it's really worth giving Keto bad advice just once to see how the "losing" story turns out. It is one of my favorite moments in any game anywhere.
Cespenar says, "Kelsey and friends be at the Pocket Plane? Ohhh yesssss!" http://www.pocketplane.net

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Re: question about Keto's song in the bard competition
« Reply #4 on: June 13, 2009, 08:19:57 AM »
Thanks for the replies, jcompton.

So can I just check: the two mods will work okay together and make sense (i.e. no Keto story about a dead Yoshi while he's still alive) provided you don't have both in the party at the same time?  I mean, you could install the Keeping Yoshimo mod, play a game with just Keto (no Yoshi) in your party, and she can still enter and win the bard competition, telling a non-Yoshi story in the process?

If this is the case, then the authors of Keeping Yoshimo could simply put a (spoiler-free) note in their readme saying that a player shouldn't have Keto and Yoshi in their party at the same time.

Offline jcompton

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Re: question about Keto's song in the bard competition
« Reply #5 on: June 13, 2009, 02:12:24 PM »
So can I just check: the two mods will work okay together and make sense (i.e. no Keto story about a dead Yoshi while he's still alive) provided you don't have both in the party at the same time?  I mean, you could install the Keeping Yoshimo mod, play a game with just Keto (no Yoshi) in your party, and she can still enter and win the bard competition, telling a non-Yoshi story in the process?

That's correct.

If Keto never befriends Yoshimo, then she doesn't talk about him.

If she does, she will talk about him, regardless of any other mods which may alter his fate.
Cespenar says, "Kelsey and friends be at the Pocket Plane? Ohhh yesssss!" http://www.pocketplane.net

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Re: question about Keto's song in the bard competition
« Reply #6 on: June 13, 2009, 03:58:52 PM »
Great, many thanks.

 

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