Author Topic: Impressive  (Read 13171 times)

Offline Ashara

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Impressive
« on: February 16, 2006, 11:15:15 PM »
Have been playing for two days, and I like him a lot. A bit on the weaker side, as compared to Bg2 and other customs, plus it is a bit scary that he comes with dagger and staff profs, but the character himself is spot on, and the voicing is awsome. Cernd in particular has a great a-la BioWARE voice.  Lo-o-o-vely!
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There is nothing better than imagining other worlds [...] to forget the painful one we live in. At least so I thought then. I hadn't yet realized that, imagining other worlds, you end up changing this one.
-Umberto Eco, Baudolino

Three mods you shall make - one too bad and one to dread and one to love.

Offline Kulyok

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Re: Impressive
« Reply #1 on: February 17, 2006, 01:01:59 AM »
Oh. Thank you - but I'll have to disappoint you, I'm afraid: we only had a new voice for Xan. For Cernd and other Biowares, I simply used rare sounds - or ToB sounds. [CERND04] and [CERND66], for example.

But I am happy that you're enjoying it so far. If anythings seems out of line, I'll be happy to hear about it, too.

Weaker - you mean you'd like him as a sorcerer, too?

Offline Azazello

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Re: Impressive
« Reply #2 on: February 17, 2006, 02:02:38 AM »
A sorcerer's not more powerful. Just different.  :D
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Offline Kulyok

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Re: Impressive
« Reply #3 on: February 17, 2006, 02:23:08 AM »
I know, and I like sorcerers, too. Well... probably I'll finish Russian translation and toss a sorcerer tweak into the next update. Meanwhile, playing with an Enchanter can be a challenge, as well. :)

Offline Ashara

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Re: Impressive
« Reply #4 on: February 17, 2006, 09:44:13 AM »
Well, my main problem is lack of specialization in a non-melee weapon and how far he was lagging behind in levels. My party was at lvl 11 when we met him, and he was on lvl 7. I put more XP on him. I would not mind Sorcerer tweak, of course, but I'd rather have him coming with dagger and dart profs instead of dagger/staff and some sort of a protection item for AC, because at that point of the game, even if it's bracers of AC 6.

As for the challenge, well, I have Amber, Aerie, Cernd and Kivan, so basically in the end I find him not so much 'challenging' as 'give him a sling and let him try to hit something with it, while the rest do the quick killing'. But don't forget that I am comparing him against Nalia whom I dropped in his favor, and Nalia has a thick layer of icing she is served with: bow profs, ring of AC+2, and good traps/locks skills.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2006, 10:02:30 AM by Ashara »
Hang in there. I'll try to make you glad you did.
—George R.R. Martin

There is nothing better than imagining other worlds [...] to forget the painful one we live in. At least so I thought then. I hadn't yet realized that, imagining other worlds, you end up changing this one.
-Umberto Eco, Baudolino

Three mods you shall make - one too bad and one to dread and one to love.

Offline Echon

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Re: Impressive
« Reply #5 on: February 17, 2006, 10:06:12 AM »
How do you want a wizard to specialise in a wepon?

-Echon

Offline Ashara

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Re: Impressive
« Reply #6 on: February 17, 2006, 10:10:54 AM »
I meant 'being profecient', 'having a star in'  When I picked Xan up he had a star in Dagger (Moonblade) and a star in Quarterstaffs. Not a single star in anything range. I suggest that Quaterstaff star is replaced by darts star. I guess, one can give him throwing daggers, but I don't remeber if there were an equivalent of the Crimson Darts  (ie magic, return to user) ones in the game.

Besides, in BG1, his second proficiency is "Missile Weapons" on LVL 6, not Quarterstaff.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2006, 10:14:30 AM by Ashara »
Hang in there. I'll try to make you glad you did.
—George R.R. Martin

There is nothing better than imagining other worlds [...] to forget the painful one we live in. At least so I thought then. I hadn't yet realized that, imagining other worlds, you end up changing this one.
-Umberto Eco, Baudolino

Three mods you shall make - one too bad and one to dread and one to love.

Offline Kulyok

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Re: Impressive
« Reply #7 on: February 17, 2006, 10:20:16 AM »
Xan comes at 9,11,12 or 13 level depending on your PC's level. Your PC(a bard?) probably was short on experience.

Actually, he gets the dart proficiency at 12th level - 800.000XP, or you can give it to him, once he enters this level.
Though casting Greater Malison+Emotion/Chaos sounds more rational to me than slinging darts... but that's just me.


Quote
Besides, in BG1, his second proficiency is "Missile Weapons" on LVL 6, not Quarterstaff.

They didn't have the Staff of the Magi in BG1. :) But I heard you.

Offline Kulyok

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Re: Impressive
« Reply #8 on: February 17, 2006, 10:25:05 AM »
About bracers of AC6: I'd rather have more opinions on this.

My experience as a player: I almost always have Kelsey installed.  If I do not plan to keep him in my party, I enter the Government district, take him in, strip him naked and let him go. Not nice, is it?

There are expensive bracers of AC4 and AC3 around. Bracers of AC6 you get for free in Xzar's default quest at the Docks. And there is Stoneskin.

Offline the bigg

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Re: Impressive
« Reply #9 on: February 17, 2006, 10:26:07 AM »
There is an easily-obteinable +2 returning dagger in a tavern in the Bridge district (not the Five Flagons, the other one), on a party of random adventurers.

However, this would disrupt the Gong Quest  :(
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Offline Kulyok

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Re: Impressive
« Reply #10 on: February 17, 2006, 10:29:01 AM »
There is an easily-obteinable +2 returning dagger in a tavern in the Bridge district (not the Five Flagons, the other one), on a party of random adventurers.

However, this would disrupt the Gong Quest  :(

Ah, yes. By the way, Ashara used it in BG1 NPC Project, too, in Kivan's quest on the sea shore.

(And I never ever completed the Gong Quest... Shame on me.)

Offline Ashara

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Re: Impressive
« Reply #11 on: February 17, 2006, 10:33:02 AM »
My PC is a paladin, he had some 500,000 XP (I know because I was upping Xan's to 535000) :) Well, I am a great fan of Crimson darts, and I loaded him up with acid arrows spells so I'll see if he can be useful.

Quote
There are expensive bracers of AC4 and AC3 around. Bracers of AC6 you get for free in Xzar's default quest at the Docks. And there is Stoneskin.

Yes, both bought and cannot be taken away (Aerie, Cernd). And yes, you might get a lot of stuff from the quests, but I am all for having a few non-exceptional  items on an NPC so you don't have to worry about re-equipping them immediately. :)
Hang in there. I'll try to make you glad you did.
—George R.R. Martin

There is nothing better than imagining other worlds [...] to forget the painful one we live in. At least so I thought then. I hadn't yet realized that, imagining other worlds, you end up changing this one.
-Umberto Eco, Baudolino

Three mods you shall make - one too bad and one to dread and one to love.

Offline Kulyok

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Re: Impressive
« Reply #12 on: February 17, 2006, 10:48:30 AM »
My PC is a paladin, he had some 500,000 XP (I know because I was upping Xan's to 535000) :) Well, I am a great fan of Crimson darts, and I loaded him up with acid arrows spells so I'll see if he can be useful.

Crimson Dart from the Watcher's Keep? Ah, I see. :) I'll
- add a Sorcerer Tweak
- accomodate for missile players' needs and tweak the proficiencies,

I am at a complete loss about the experience, however. We have run extensive tests(and I've just repeated a few of them): if your PC has 500.000XP, Xan will have 400.000XP. No alternatives; Cam's script works perfectly.


Quote
Yes, both bought and cannot be taken away (Aerie, Cernd). And yes, you might get a lot of stuff from the quests, but I am all for having a few non-exceptional  items on an NPC so you don't have to worry about re-equipping them immediately. :)

I fully agree, but Xan has a special situation - if you went through the joining dialogue, you know what happened to him in Athkatla. :) So I'm afraid the chance of giving him some magical items is slim.

But if you go to Trademeet, and kill that Rakshasa, a visit to a local smithy afterwards might be quite rewarding... If you have a spare 5000 gp, that is.

Offline Ashara

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Re: Impressive
« Reply #13 on: February 17, 2006, 11:36:59 AM »
Quote
I am at a complete loss about the experience, however. We have run extensive tests(and I've just repeated a few of them): if your PC has 500.000XP, Xan will have 400.000XP. No alternatives; Cam's script works perfectly.

No big deal, don't worry,  maybe I was slightly lower, thought the only thing I did after joining Xan was Amber's Quest, which should not have been too high on the XP. Lower level makes sense anyway story-wise.

As for his incident, well, there is a difference between cutting a man's purse off and taking clothes off his back.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2006, 11:39:38 AM by Ashara »
Hang in there. I'll try to make you glad you did.
—George R.R. Martin

There is nothing better than imagining other worlds [...] to forget the painful one we live in. At least so I thought then. I hadn't yet realized that, imagining other worlds, you end up changing this one.
-Umberto Eco, Baudolino

Three mods you shall make - one too bad and one to dread and one to love.

Offline Princeps

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Re: Impressive
« Reply #14 on: February 17, 2006, 02:02:04 PM »
There is an easily-obteinable +2 returning dagger in a tavern in the Bridge district (not the Five Flagons, the other one), on a party of random adventurers.

And it does 2d4 damage. Darts? Nahhh.  ;D

Offline Ashara

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Re: Impressive
« Reply #15 on: February 17, 2006, 02:14:11 PM »
Crimson Darts are iirc +3 (or +4?) bag of darts available any time in the game from the first level of the WK and they come in the endless stack. They are shot at an alarming speed and great for taking down spellcasters. Yay for DARTS!  :D
Hang in there. I'll try to make you glad you did.
—George R.R. Martin

There is nothing better than imagining other worlds [...] to forget the painful one we live in. At least so I thought then. I hadn't yet realized that, imagining other worlds, you end up changing this one.
-Umberto Eco, Baudolino

Three mods you shall make - one too bad and one to dread and one to love.

Offline Tameon the Dragoon

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Re: Impressive
« Reply #16 on: February 17, 2006, 03:59:48 PM »
This may be being picky, but perhaps the option of trueclass Mage and Wild Mage? I always change Xan to Wild Mage in BGI, and alot of people seem to like the whole "no kit" approach. Just a thought; ignore me if it's too much.

Offline Azazello

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Re: Impressive
« Reply #17 on: February 17, 2006, 06:23:48 PM »
I think Tutu spoiled us when it comes to kit choices. I never thought of Xan as a Wild Mage, but I really like that idea.  Adds extra explanation for his dourness.

If understand correctly being an Enchanter is actually part of the story we will learn about Xan in BG2. I'll play him that way the first run-thru. But I also put my vote in for the tweak to have different kit options.
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Offline Princeps

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Re: Impressive
« Reply #18 on: February 18, 2006, 12:24:37 AM »
Crimson Darts are iirc +3 (or +4?) bag of darts available any time in the game from the first level of the WK and they come in the endless stack. They are shot at an alarming speed and great for taking down spellcasters. Yay for DARTS!  :D

Darts are for whimps. Daggers are for real men (of either gender) ;D On a more serious note, it is easy enough to change a character's proficiencies with SK. I do that occasionally just to get some variation.

On the class issue, in my opinion, it would have made more sense if Bioware had made Xan a fighter/mage, considering the moonblade. Which is really a sword. Not a dagger. Which is not to say that daggers aren't great. Because they are... just great. Cut! Slice! Homicide! Er... sorry. Hrm. Got... carried away. I'll just... go...  :)

Offline Kulyok

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Re: Impressive
« Reply #19 on: February 18, 2006, 01:14:25 AM »
Wild mages... mages... sorcerers... Enchanters... fighter-mages...

I'll go and have a lie down somewhere. :)

Anyway: Yes, the story revolves around Xan being an Enchanter, so, should you choose another class for him in the next version, you may feel a bit uncomfortable later. If you are okay with this, and still want to change his class - then go ahead. For the moment, Shadow Keeper is your friend.

Offline Tameon the Dragoon

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Re: Impressive
« Reply #20 on: February 18, 2006, 02:01:00 AM »
Anyway: Yes, the story revolves around Xan being an Enchanter, so, should you choose another class for him in the next version, you may feel a bit uncomfortable later. If you are okay with this, and still want to change his class - then go ahead. For the moment, Shadow Keeper is your friend.


Ah, that's cool. Perfectly understandable.  ;)

Offline Princeps

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Re: Impressive
« Reply #21 on: February 18, 2006, 03:10:51 AM »
Wild mages... mages... sorcerers... Enchanters... fighter-mages...

I'll go and have a lie down somewhere. :)

There,there, an enchanter is just fine. They are cute, cuddly, and... enchant things.  :)

Offline Ashara

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Re: Impressive
« Reply #22 on: February 18, 2006, 09:27:14 AM »
If he is strongly leaning towards the Enchanter (and I saw him reffered to as an Enchanter at least once already) I'll play with him as an Enchanter. Perhaps it can be added to the NPCs Kit Tweak pack instead of the main body of the mod then? Sort of the same way you'd like to deal with the portraits? Enchanter is an unrepresented Sub-Class in BG2, and follows BG1 original character pattern... On the other hand, there are two Sorcerers already available, and stuff. Power in violation of the Story are imo not really a successfull trade-off. If people want to play with an uber-powerful-arch-mage-that-lays-waste-to-Athkatla-in-two-turns there is always Solaufein or Irenicus out there.
Hang in there. I'll try to make you glad you did.
—George R.R. Martin

There is nothing better than imagining other worlds [...] to forget the painful one we live in. At least so I thought then. I hadn't yet realized that, imagining other worlds, you end up changing this one.
-Umberto Eco, Baudolino

Three mods you shall make - one too bad and one to dread and one to love.

Offline Kulyok

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Re: Impressive
« Reply #23 on: February 18, 2006, 02:10:56 PM »
I enjoy Idobek's Kit Pack, too, and I think it would be a nice solution, especially since I have the code and sixteen additional files (Mage, Wild Mage(ToB), Sorcerer and Fighter/Mage) already. Once I see Idobek online, perhaps - if he is interested, that is. Failing that, I can easily add an extra component for interested players in the next release.


Offline Ashara

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Re: Impressive
« Reply #24 on: February 21, 2006, 09:25:59 AM »
Okay, I have almost finished the game, only last battles in Suldanessellar are remaining (the palace). So, here are my impressions:

First of all, I sorted out the "power" issues, by talking to that smith and purchasing first the boomerang dagger and later the firetooth in the Underdark. As an Enchanter, Xan gets a far wider range of spells, that work pretty well in combat. In fact, by whatever reason, I never got the fireball spell for Aerie either, and played without it till we got Deheriana. Well, apparently it's quite possible. Acid arrows, Malision, Confusion, Breaches, Death SPells etc are all working out very well :)

The mod is very very good. It is unfortunate that insanely-developped custom NPCs came so late... they are much better fare than Bio's as far as the game immersion is concerned.

I ended this game with only one BioWARE NPC in the party - Aerie (the ones I had previously, slowly substituting for the customs were Nalia, Cernd and Haer'Dalis). I have to say that between Kivan, Amber and Xan - all of them on *friendship* paths (!) - it was a rewarding experience, where NPCs felt like real companions, who paid attention to what was going on around them.

Aerie I had on the *romance* path, and one can really see the difference between BioWARE's writing recycling the same topic over and  over and the custom NPCs variable conversations, covering a wide range of topics.I like Aerie's personality and the story-line, but at some point she just... stalled. If I was Aerie, I would be running away with Haer'Dalis not my PC, because *his* banter with her were much more inspired than my basic two options: a boring one (be strong) and a more boring one (stop whining).

In Xan's case, some of his personal conversations were particulary endearing (his poor health after the Mulahey's Dungeons, for example), and some were expected (covering the bases of PCs personal trials). This attention of the custom NPCs to PC problems leaves in the dust the old premise that there is nothing to talk about with the PC! Interestingly enough only very few of the thematic dialogues and interjections exhibited the "sameness" between Xan, Kivan and Amber, making it an ideal party both class- and content- wise. The number of the dialogues in the friendship path was enough to keep me occupied from the beginning to the end of the game, and I am not even sure if I finished the cycle (probably yes) The reply options were variable enough (except for one conversation, about money, which in my particular situation - I role-played a classical paladin that spends everything on the equipment or donations, and pretty much never had more than 8,000 gp in my purse- I found my self struggling to find some sort of a fitting reply). The timing of the dialogues was pretty good, I had only three of them showing up inopportunely - one that I have mentioned already, upon Xan's joining, and two in the dragon Layers - in Firkraag's and in Adalon's.

A big thumb up goes to the PID options which were the most developped I have seen to date.

Xan's story was quite nicely tied into the game, with a very in-character twist in the beginning and a few Xanish events as we went. It was in perfect accordance with his BG1 role.

The ingenious way of having the banters with the other NPC written and voiced was sweet, and they worked very well with BioWARE banters both style and length wise.

Interjections were numerous, and that in my view was the only minus in the mod. There were just too many... and in some areas they were overwhelming - the Sahuagin city was one, and another, in the Umar Hills inn, not only Xan interjected twice in the same convo with the Inkeep, he also broke into a dialogue at waking up. It was slightly irritating - but, again - for me, though I can't say how much I appreciate the work that went into looking for all these places to interject and adding them :)

There was only a couple of occasions, where I thought Xan's information was spoilerish (if one can be spoiled 5 years after the game release!): he mentioned that he was sent to fight the vampires at the time when everyone else in the game was vague about it (I have no idea why they did it that way to be honest) and when he piped in that Irenicus would lose his memory in the conversation with Demin (I always liked the Irenicus-Ellesime dialogue, so I was a bit pouty about having the er... "surprise" taken away). Other than that he was always spot on and aware of what was going on.

It's a great mod, and an interesting, well-developped character and definetly a keeper. In conclusion, the cross-mod banter content will be very welcome.
« Last Edit: February 21, 2006, 09:39:03 AM by Ashara »
Hang in there. I'll try to make you glad you did.
—George R.R. Martin

There is nothing better than imagining other worlds [...] to forget the painful one we live in. At least so I thought then. I hadn't yet realized that, imagining other worlds, you end up changing this one.
-Umberto Eco, Baudolino

Three mods you shall make - one too bad and one to dread and one to love.

 

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