Author Topic: Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread  (Read 9817 times)

Offline Jon

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Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread
« on: January 25, 2006, 06:04:20 PM »
Let it be known that a month or two ago I decided to read the entire Harry Potter series. I had already read 1-4, so I reread them, and now I'm halfway done with the Order.
Now I'm going to complain about the books.

Rowlings writing style is a great disappointment to me. It's far too obvious that she's writing the books so twelve year old kids can understand it. It so irritates me how this series is yet another one of those things that could have been great and amazing, but instead (for the sake of making more money by appealing to a wider audience, I guess) ended up being just another so-so piece of work that many people will only read for the sake of finding out what happens. Not because the book is actually good. If it weren't for an interesting storyline (which seems to be nonexistant in the fifth one; more on that later) and for Hermione's character dragging them along, I would sell my Harry Potter books on eBay.

If you've ever read Stephen Kings On Writing, then you'll understand me that I find JK Rowlings lawn disgustingly covered in dandelions.
If you haven't read that book, allow me to make this more clear.

A fun quote from On Writing is "While to write adverbs is human, to write he said or she said is divine."
Taken straight from the book, folks.

"Harry, that's against the rules!", Hermione stated lawfully.
"Ron, we're not allowed to do that!", Hermione said forcefully.
"I'm a pathetic excuse for a literary support character, have the IQ of the kitten I couldn't Transform, and blurt things out on a regular basis!", Ron blurted out stupidly.

These are dandelions. Dandelions are adverbs. Dandelions ruin lawns. Adverbs ruin stories.

Look, Rowling; I've read four and a half of your books. I know by simple repition like a sledge hammer whacking my face for an hour that Hermione speaks lawfully and Ron is a moron who blurts things out. And for those who haven't read four and a half of your books, there's a fun thing called context that tells us how a person said something.

If Hermione and Harry are arguing (while Ron tosses in/blurts out his usual pointless four-word interjections) about something, Harry is nearly yelling trying to defend his case while Hermione argues back with laws straight from the book, I don't think we need all the "Hermione stated matter-of-factly" and whatnot.  I may not be making any sense at all and I may not be using good examples, but I think you all know what i mean and I hope at least some of you agree with me when I say
THERE ARE TOO MANY ADVERBS.

And there are too many things like "Well, I'm glad those goblins ran away frightened to death of my simple lumos spell," sighed Harry, relieved now that the goblins and he are at a safe distance.

Know what I mean? No? I hope so. I don't want to have to stop eating my pasta to crack open The Order and find the example that really ticked me off today after school. I was sitting outside trying to enjoy life when Rowing hits me with another blood-sucking adverb.

Well, it was a phrase, like that example above. Adverbial phrase? Whatever. Anyway. Harry, Ron, and Hermione were heatedly* conversing with other Hogwarts students about teaching themselves Defense Against the Dark Arts, and boy did Rowling shove a fire-lit wand up Hermiones ass with another bloody adverb.. Gah.

*(See that word "heatedly"? See how I crossed it out? That's called editing. It's called mowing the lawn, Rowling. Mowing the bloody lawn..)

What else, what else? It's hard to remember everything I wanted to say.

All the characters are very one-dimensional like Velloxyly (or whoever) said in another Harry Potter thread. And they always say the same thing with the same lousy dandelions dangling from their words.

Harry himself really began getting on my nerves in the fourth book. With each page his PMS rises higher and higher, Ron becomes more and more stupid and useless, and Hermione becomes even more under-appreciated. I really like her, and I really dislike how, well, under-appreciated she is. Of the three, she's the only one with any depth at all; at least sometimes she'll do something like break a rule for the sake of true goodness and justice or something.

The fifth book was pretty good in the beginning; once Harry dragged his angst-y butt back to Hogwarts, it began to drive it's into the ground face first. I don't really need to give any examples, do I? Just read a page or two from one of your books. PMS in text form.

By the way, I am fully aware that PMS is a girl thing. Just bear with me, okay?

The Order seems more like a very, very sad attempt at a political-like book right now. The only thing that really happens is 'the man' (the Ministry) laying its iron fist on the people (Hogwarts and all them, obviously). Other than that, it's just male PMS from Harry, stupidity from Ron, lawful statements from Hermione, and some jealousy of Sirius (jealousy isn't quite the word I'd want to use, but it'll do).
Oh, and did I mention literary dandelions? Lots of them?
Fudge shouldn't be worried about Dumbledores 'army' of fifteen year olds; he should be more concerned with Rowlings bullshit army of dandelions...

This book is just such a disappointment to me. I can't remember anything else and this is long enough as it is. I've been doing a lot of complaining in here..

Sorry. I feel very let down by Rowling; I've been searching and searching for something good, and had my hopes up for Potter, but I guess that just won't work out the way I'd hoped. Needed to clear off my chest.

And the relationship with Ron and Hermione I've heard about; it just sounds like a terrible idea to me. Really stupid moron going out with smart, good-natured girl; God..   I was sort of hoping if there must be any relationship at all that it'd be with Harry and Hermione, but I'd much rather the three remain as close friends.
But no. Oh well.

There are about a hundred different ways in which I hate Rowling elementary writing style. I will not point them out and you probably wouldn't read them if I did ;)

Oh, and it'd be nice if we could read some about what's going on outside of Hogwarts. But you know, that really wouldn't work. Until book four, always remaining in the perspective of Harry has worked out quite well; but since book four, and even more so in book five, I'd much rather just read a bulleted list of what happens in the story than actually read the books.

Okay, now it is time for me to end this post. Sorry I whinned about this for so long.

No, no. One last thing. Can anyone reccomend a good book or two to a disappointed reader of Harry Potter and fan of Tolkien?
Thanks. Sorry. Good day to you.
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Offline jcompton

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Re: Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread
« Reply #1 on: January 25, 2006, 06:56:17 PM »
My standard advice for anyone disappointed in their long-winded over-wordy fantasy series of choice is Roger Zelazny's Amber series, which you can buy for a song.
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Offline icelus

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Re: Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread
« Reply #2 on: January 25, 2006, 06:56:54 PM »
Yes, but only the first half...

Oh, and I'll beat Domi to the punch: George R.R. Martin's A Song of Ice and Fire series is, in my opinion, quite good. 
« Last Edit: January 25, 2006, 07:18:00 PM by icelus »
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Offline Eral

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Re: Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread
« Reply #3 on: January 25, 2006, 07:10:55 PM »
Stephen Donaldson 'Chronicles of Thomas Covenant the Unbeliever'  (Book 1 is "Lord Foul's Bane")
Anything by Ursula LeGuin
Robert Silverberg 'Majipoor' series (Book 1 -"Lord Valentine's Castle")
Megan Lindholm 'Windsingers'/Robin Hobb 'Livetraders' and 'Assasains' -'Fools' series.
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Offline CORVIS TERRIBLE MOUNTAIN GOD

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Re: Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread
« Reply #4 on: January 25, 2006, 08:21:44 PM »
Yes, but only the first half...

Oh, and I'll beat Domi to the punch: George R.R. Martin's A Song of Ice and Fire series is, in my opinion, quite good. 

Not if you're tired of stories that go on longer than they should, no.

Offline Bex

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Re: Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread
« Reply #5 on: January 25, 2006, 09:09:07 PM »
You should read JC's thread "Action text and abuses thereof."

It's relevant, even thought it's not fantasy fiction.

Or is it?!
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Offline melora

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Re: Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread
« Reply #6 on: January 25, 2006, 09:10:03 PM »
Yes, but only the first half...

Oh, and I'll beat Domi to the punch: George R.R. Martin's A Song of Ice and Fire series is, in my opinion, quite good. 

both great !
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Offline Andyr

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Re: Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread
« Reply #7 on: January 26, 2006, 05:20:43 AM »
Oh, and I'll beat Domi to the punch: George R.R. Martin's A Song of Ice and Fire series is, in my opinion, quite good. 

I've not read those but his Dying of the Light is a good read. :)
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Offline Evaine Dian

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Re: Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread
« Reply #8 on: January 26, 2006, 05:25:24 AM »
I think Rowling's style is alright. Maybe it just annoys you because (if your profile is right) you're not much older than 12 yourself and want to stand out from the crowd of little kids. :)
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Offline Kulyok

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Re: Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread
« Reply #9 on: January 26, 2006, 05:45:18 AM »
Well, besides Pratchett (what, nobody mentioned Pratchett?):
- Neil Gaiman("Good Omens" with Pratchett is a must-have);
- Stanislav Lem("Solaris" and short stories. With other books, prepare for a massive headache);
- Roger Zelazny("Chronicles of Amber", prepare for mysteries and loose ends);
- Clifford Saimak("The Goblin Reservation" and others. Personally, "Way station" is my favourite);
- Michail Bulgakov(everything);
- when Lukyanenko/Perumov/Panov/Frei will be translated... mmm...
(Shekli is pure ski-fi, otherwise...)


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Offline Borsook

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Re: Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread
« Reply #10 on: January 26, 2006, 07:22:16 AM »
@Jon - the main point you seem to be missing is that HP were "designed" as books for children, even if they grew more adult in the mean time I'd say it is good that there are no lnguistic barrier stoping original target audience from understanding them.
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Offline melora

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Re: Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread
« Reply #11 on: January 26, 2006, 08:25:31 AM »
Chronicles of Amber is still my favorite series, but the new ones arent quite as good.  prequels written by someone else, who i am sorry to say just isnt zelazny (rest in peace).   they're still good, especially to an amber fan.  just not quite as outstanding as the originals.
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Offline Borsook

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Re: Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread
« Reply #12 on: January 26, 2006, 12:36:25 PM »
Chronicles of Amber is still my favorite series, but the new ones arent quite as good.  prequels written by someone else, who i am sorry to say just isnt zelazny (rest in peace).   they're still good, especially to an amber fan.  just not quite as outstanding as the originals.
Erm sorry for being ignorant, who dared to write prequels to Amber?
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Offline Bex

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Re: Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread
« Reply #13 on: January 26, 2006, 12:40:25 PM »
The Last Unicorn by Peter S. Beagle is a really beautifully-written fastasy book.
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Offline jcompton

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Re: Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread
« Reply #14 on: January 26, 2006, 01:22:26 PM »
Chronicles of Amber is still my favorite series, but the new ones arent quite as good.  prequels written by someone else, who i am sorry to say just isnt zelazny (rest in peace).   they're still good, especially to an amber fan.  just not quite as outstanding as the originals.
Erm sorry for being ignorant, who dared to write prequels to Amber?

John Betancourt has been writing the new novels, authorized by Zelazny's estate (but there's some controversy over that, blah blah blah.)

I haven't tried reading them yet. Betancourt himself is a nice guy, but I can't say I've been in a rush to expose myself to potential disappointment on the Amber front.
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Offline fcm

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Re: Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread
« Reply #15 on: January 26, 2006, 02:05:01 PM »
Anything Redwall > Harry Potter.

I want to read The Last Unicorn, but haven't gotten around to it. I still have to read Watership Down . . . among other things that I'll do instead of the Hobbes and Plato I'm supposed to be reading.
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Offline Ghreyfain

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Re: Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread
« Reply #16 on: January 26, 2006, 02:10:39 PM »
...Hobbes and Plato...

What about Calvin and Hobbes?  Fine literary works.
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Offline icelus

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Re: Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread
« Reply #17 on: January 26, 2006, 02:28:35 PM »
I'm afraid I must concur with the delegate from Alberta on this matter.
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Offline Joe

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Re: Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread
« Reply #18 on: January 26, 2006, 06:55:47 PM »
Let me say that I have been similarly disappointed with Robert Jordan's Wheel of Time. Plagiarized and written in a style of sheer mediocrity.

Offline melora

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Re: Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread
« Reply #19 on: January 26, 2006, 09:31:53 PM »
The Last Unicorn by Peter S. Beagle is a really beautifully-written fastasy book.

did you read his "A Fine and Private Place" ?  i loved that one too.
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Offline Veloxyll

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Re: Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread
« Reply #20 on: January 26, 2006, 10:22:37 PM »
Let me say that I have been similarly disappointed with Robert Jordan's Wheel of Time. Plagiarized and written in a style of sheer mediocrity.

There is one slight difference. Rowlings intends to finish this series at least at book 7 (We hope). Jordan intends to keep going on and on and on and on in his awful writing style until his childrens childrens children are dead
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Offline Joe

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Re: Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread
« Reply #21 on: January 26, 2006, 11:03:35 PM »

There is one slight difference. Rowlings intends to finish this series at least at book 7 (We hope). Jordan intends to keep going on and on and on and on in his awful writing style until his childrens childrens children are dead


I'm pretty sure he's milking his fans for all their worth.

Offline Drew

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Re: Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread
« Reply #22 on: January 26, 2006, 11:46:40 PM »
It's far too obvious that she's writing the books so twelve year old kids can understand it. It so irritates me how this series is yet another one of those things that could have been great and amazing, but instead (for the sake of making more money by appealing to a wider audience, I guess) ended up being just another so-so piece of work that many people will only read for the sake of finding out what happens.
Umm......I kind of thought the reason she wrote it so twelve year old kids could understand it was because she, uh, wrote it for twelve year old kids. It wasn't to make more money.  Twelve year old kids were kind of the target audience.

Let me say that I have been similarly disappointed with Robert Jordan's Wheel of Time. Plagiarized and written in a style of sheer mediocrity.
Plagiarized?  Say it sucks if you want, but you really should provide proof when accusing an author of something so severe.
« Last Edit: January 26, 2006, 11:48:47 PM by Drew »
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Offline Veloxyll

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Re: Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread
« Reply #23 on: January 27, 2006, 12:40:20 AM »
He plagarises his own work. see book 8.

And yeah, hate to say it, but the Harry Potter books are Childrens books. That's the reason behind the teenage protagonist.
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Offline Ghreyfain

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Re: Sorry about this - The next Harry Potter Thread
« Reply #24 on: January 27, 2006, 01:38:13 AM »
That's not to say that books aimed at 12-year-olds can't be fun.  See the Taran Wanderer series, for instance.  Although admittedly, I read it when I was twelvish, so my perspective could be skewed.  Lirael, by Garth Nix, is another good example.  I read that trilogy just recently, and while it had its flaws, I managed to get into the right frame of mind to enjoy it.

Harry Potter, however, blows.
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