Author Topic: Thief-related stuff  (Read 8765 times)

Offline SixOfSpades

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Thief-related stuff
« on: January 08, 2005, 07:51:22 PM »
When speaking to Mae'Var, I notice a "I was sent by Renal Bloodscalp to investigate you and your activities" thread that I don't think was there before. Is this courtesy of Quest Pack or the Improved Thief Stronghold? I notice that if you kill Mae'Var using this option, the other residents of his Guildhall do not turn Hostile, which is good in that Arkanis Gath does not spawn, but bad in that you are unable to clean out a den of Thieves.

What happens to Rayic's Ring? You hand it to Edwin and it vanishes into thin air? I Pickpocketed him and got nothing, then went to the Copper Coronet and killed him, still nothing. Will he have it if you recruit him? I'm sure Edwin realizes the danger of appearing in public wearing the signet ring of a man who's just been murdered in his own home, but it's still a decent protective item that Edwin would do well to keep around. (Mae'Var disposing from the spoils of your Temple-robbing job makes more sense, as he presumably has time and arrangements to pass the item to a fence.)

Dialogue bug with Mae'Var--we'd just finished slaughtering his guild, we go down into his basement, the "Mae'Var must die, there is no turning back now" message appears (probably a result of Tactics or Improved Thief Stronghold), and Scratchy attacks us, but Mae'Var himself is neutral and will say nothing except his "leave the thinkers to their thinking" line, the one where the party has the option to come clean with him. I actually had to TELL him we were attacking him before he turned Hostile.

I then went to see Renal--despite the fact that the PC is a Berserker and GABBER was a Cleric, he tried to offer me Mae'Var's Guild. As I don't have Multi-Strongholds enabled, this may be a holdover from Rogue Rebalancing or something.

I then Saved, and attacked Renal to test his difficulty, getting around Arkanis Gath by Ctrl-Qing and booting him. Then we went down into Aran's Lair, killing Hostiles as we went. Had an interesting conversation with Aran, where we agreed to go down to the docks and find Mook even as we were killing his Mislead. As soon as Aran fell, Larell (neutral) and two other Thieves (hostile) appeared, apparently becase we'd killed Renal. I chose a convarsation option that turned Larell hostile.

Combat Thoughts: The order, in my mind, should be Aran > Renal > Mae'Var > Larell.
1) Aran could stand to be a bit tougher, by raising his guards a couple of levels for better THAC0, and sending his Mislead away from the door, not toward. As long as Aran's offensive power isn't anywhere near that of aVENGER'S "Shadow Thief Improvements" version (with STI installed, Aran can and will do over 120 damage on each hit, of which he has about 4 per round), the Mislead cheese becomes less of a serious threat. Having a Priest present would also be good. Of course, this is his "siding with Aran" difficulty, I've yet to try him when working for Bodhi or Brega.
2) Renal has always suffered from a lack of strong backup, and a poor AI. If everyone there was given a few Potions and the knowhow to use them, and a couple of spellcasters were thrown in, he'd be a worthy opponent. The majority of his guards should start out hidden in shadows.
3) Quest Pack's treatment of Mae'Var is the best I've seen so far, at least for a Chapter 2-3 party. He and his Cleric could stand to cast a bit more, though.
4) Larell is way overpowered. What's with his hacked ApR and resistances? And those Gloves have got to be changed. Assassin + Gloves of Backstabbing + any 2 from (S.S.o.B., Quietus, S.S.o.Olidammarra) = Backstab x11 damage, I don't even know the Latin for that much. Heck, that would give a Quintuple multiplier to a danged Swashbuckler. Suggestions: Make him legal (some small innate Resistances would be fine), and have the Gloves confer *** in Dagger and Short Sword, and an extra 1/2 attack per round. And perhaps an Item Description that implies the Gloves are a bit more uncommon than the current version does.
« Last Edit: January 08, 2005, 09:55:28 PM by SixOfSpades »

Offline SimDing0™

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Re: Thief-related stuff
« Reply #1 on: January 09, 2005, 10:06:33 AM »
When speaking to Mae'Var, I notice a "I was sent by Renal Bloodscalp to investigate you and your activities" thread that I don't think was there before. Is this courtesy of Quest Pack or the Improved Thief Stronghold? I notice that if you kill Mae'Var using this option, the other residents of his Guildhall do not turn Hostile, which is good in that Arkanis Gath does not spawn, but bad in that you are unable to clean out a den of Thieves.
The new option's me, yeh. Arkanis Gath shouldn't spawn at all if you just murder Mae'Var straight off, however you do it, so I'll check that.

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What happens to Rayic's Ring? You hand it to Edwin and it vanishes into thin air? I Pickpocketed him and got nothing, then went to the Copper Coronet and killed him, still nothing. Will he have it if you recruit him? I'm sure Edwin realizes the danger of appearing in public wearing the signet ring of a man who's just been murdered in his own home, but it's still a decent protective item that Edwin would do well to keep around. (Mae'Var disposing from the spoils of your Temple-robbing job makes more sense, as he presumably has time and arrangements to pass the item to a fence.)
He actually puts it on, so you can't pickpocket it back. You say killing him didn't yield it, though? I'll take a look at that.

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Dialogue bug with Mae'Var--we'd just finished slaughtering his guild, we go down into his basement, the "Mae'Var must die, there is no turning back now" message appears (probably a result of Tactics or Improved Thief Stronghold), and Scratchy attacks us, but Mae'Var himself is neutral and will say nothing except his "leave the thinkers to their thinking" line, the one where the party has the option to come clean with him. I actually had to TELL him we were attacking him before he turned Hostile.
Noted.

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I then went to see Renal--despite the fact that the PC is a Berserker and GABBER was a Cleric, he tried to offer me Mae'Var's Guild. As I don't have Multi-Strongholds enabled, this may be a holdover from Rogue Rebalancing or something.
I'm pretty confident this isn't anything I've done.

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I then Saved, and attacked Renal to test his difficulty, getting around Arkanis Gath by Ctrl-Qing and booting him. Then we went down into Aran's Lair, killing Hostiles as we went. Had an interesting conversation with Aran, where we agreed to go down to the docks and find Mook even as we were killing his Mislead.
That'd probably always happen in vanilla BG2. I'll fix it, but I'm not inclined to spend too much time on stuff that'll never show up in a normal game.

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As soon as Aran fell, Larell (neutral) and two other Thieves (hostile) appeared, apparently becase we'd killed Renal. I chose a convarsation option that turned Larell hostile.
...but yeh, this is my fault.

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Combat Thoughts: The order, in my mind, should be Aran > Renal > Mae'Var > Larell.
Ideally, yeh, Aran'd be the toughest, but in my mind the others are on fairly equal footing.

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1) Aran could stand to be a bit tougher, by raising his guards a couple of levels for better THAC0, and sending his Mislead away from the door, not toward. As long as Aran's offensive power isn't anywhere near that of aVENGER'S "Shadow Thief Improvements" version (with STI installed, Aran can and will do over 120 damage on each hit, of which he has about 4 per round), the Mislead cheese becomes less of a serious threat. Having a Priest present would also be good. Of course, this is his "siding with Aran" difficulty, I've yet to try him when working for Bodhi or Brega.
I assure you, I won't be adding 12 damage hits 4 times per round. :) There's also a mage that only shows up in chapter 6, I think, so I'm not sure if you saw that.

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2) Renal has always suffered from a lack of strong backup, and a poor AI. If everyone there was given a few Potions and the knowhow to use them, and a couple of spellcasters were thrown in, he'd be a worthy opponent. The majority of his guards should start out hidden in shadows.
I'll probably give all Shadow Thieves a chance of having a random selection of potions, and maybe let a few hide in shadows too. I can increase the likelihood of this powering up for Renal's personal guards.

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3) Quest Pack's treatment of Mae'Var is the best I've seen so far, at least for a Chapter 2-3 party. He and his Cleric could stand to cast a bit more, though.
I'm glad there was something to salvage it all, heh. I'll see what I can do to make Mae'Var and the Cleric live a little longer.

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4) Larell is way overpowered. What's with his hacked ApR and resistances? And those Gloves have got to be changed. Assassin + Gloves of Backstabbing + any 2 from (S.S.o.B., Quietus, S.S.o.Olidammarra) = Backstab x11 damage, I don't even know the Latin for that much. Heck, that would give a Quintuple multiplier to a danged Swashbuckler. Suggestions: Make him legal (some small innate Resistances would be fine), and have the Gloves confer *** in Dagger and Short Sword, and an extra 1/2 attack per round. And perhaps an Item Description that implies the Gloves are a bit more uncommon than the current version does.
Heh, uh, yeh. Hmm. Larell's pretty terrible. Just from looking at Mae'Var's script, you can tell I was trying quite hard to make it good there, while I just wanted to get... something finished, by the time I got to Larell. I'll give Larell some serious consideration this time.
I like the idea of the gloves, however, although dropping the bonus to 1 would seem like a good idea. I don't think they're terribly overpowered until you get to the point where game balance just goes out the window (and really, what's the difference between x9 and x10 backstab at that stage?)

Offline SixOfSpades

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Re: Thief-related stuff
« Reply #2 on: January 22, 2005, 02:51:40 AM »
Some new bugs to report.

1- Returning to the main Thieves' Guildhall in Chapter 6, I went down to talk to Aran and got him to send help against Bodhi, and also recieved a duplicate Short Sword of Backstabbing courtesy of Rogue Rebalancing. I saw that I had the conversation option to warn him of a plan on his life by Mae'Var and Larell, even though I'd killed Mae'Var in Chapter 6 and had never even heard of Larell.
2- I then went back upstairs to check on Renal Bloodscalp, who was alive and well the last time I'd seen him, and there was Larell, standing in his place. CLUAing Renal back in resulted only in Renal being removed and a new Larell created.
3- I started killing Thieves (to see if Aran's assassins would still be in the Graveyard even after I'd slaughtered their Guild), and I noticed that killing each Thief did not turn the others Hostile. Larell himself *never* went hostile, even with Durkon (Cleric) slowly pounding him into a mushy pulp. It seems that only a Thief who stays alive for a full round while Hostile to the party will turn his friends Hostile as well, and the only one to accomplish this was Aran.
4- Before I killed Aran, though, I ran through his dialogue again, and saw that you could warn him about Mae'Var and Larell--and get the quest to eliminate them--over and over, although the quest reward can only be given once.

All this took place without talking to Brega, although I did speak to the messenger.

Aran's Chapter 6 difficulty is a little bit on the low side for a party that's been fighting Drow and Illithids, but when you take into account the fact that his resources are pretty depleted after the guild war, it makes sense.

Offline SimDing0™

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Re: Thief-related stuff
« Reply #3 on: January 22, 2005, 11:43:09 AM »
1 and 2 should be fixed now. Oops. I'll take a look at the others.

Offline SixOfSpades

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Re: Thief-related stuff
« Reply #4 on: January 22, 2005, 11:51:14 AM »
Cool. Another bug, though.  :(

After siding with Brega, we went to the Guild and killed averybody, and were unable to open the sealed door. (I'd been using this very room as my stronghold in Chapter 3, but was unable to access the Shadow Thief Cellar Key I'd stored here because of the map change.) We went up to the 2nd floor to find it totally empty of Thieves. The Amnish Centurion said to search the place for the key, which we did (due to the long-standing bug, 2 of the chests can only be opened via a Knock spell), but found none.

We then went to Gaelan Bayle's house to get the key from him, but he still thinks it's Chapter 3 and we're his friends, so he is unkillable.

Stuck.

Oh--correction to my previous post: It was in Chapter 3 that we killed Mae'Var. And I forgot to add that Larell had nothing to say to us, ever. He just kept turning around to always be facing whatever party member was nearest to him, as if he was almost, but not quite, initiating conversation. This makes me think that he was essentially fake-talking himself, which is why he could never go Hostile.

Offline SimDing0™

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Re: Thief-related stuff
« Reply #5 on: January 22, 2005, 12:08:36 PM »
I think you have a unique talent for just making everything go completely wrong. :) I can't give a quick answer to these, so I'll load up the game in a sec. Gaelan still thinking it's chapter 3 sounds distinctly like an original game bug to me though, since I haven't touched him at all.

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Re: Thief-related stuff
« Reply #6 on: January 22, 2005, 12:17:59 PM »
After siding with Brega, we went to the Guild and killed averybody, and were unable to open the sealed door. (I'd been using this very room as my stronghold in Chapter 3, but was unable to access the Shadow Thief Cellar Key I'd stored here because of the map change.) We went up to the 2nd floor to find it totally empty of Thieves. The Amnish Centurion said to search the place for the key, which we did (due to the long-standing bug, 2 of the chests can only be opened via a Knock spell), but found none.
Okay, hmm... did you kill Larell or Renal (whoever was there) prior to trying this? The key spawns on them, but if they're dead... yeh. I'm guessing that might be what you've run into.

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Oh--correction to my previous post: It was in Chapter 3 that we killed Mae'Var. And I forgot to add that Larell had nothing to say to us, ever. He just kept turning around to always be facing whatever party member was nearest to him, as if he was almost, but not quite, initiating conversation. This makes me think that he was essentially fake-talking himself, which is why he could never go Hostile.
So you betrayed Renal, killed Mae'Var, then went to speak to Larell? For lack of a better solution, killing Mae'Var when Larell's in power should really spawn STDEATH I guess, since it's the equivalent of killing Renal when you've done his quest.

Offline SixOfSpades

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Re: Thief-related stuff
« Reply #7 on: January 22, 2005, 08:22:19 PM »
After siding with Brega, we went to the Guild and killed averybody, and were unable to open the sealed door. (I'd been using this very room as my stronghold in Chapter 3, but was unable to access the Shadow Thief Cellar Key I'd stored here because of the map change.) We went up to the 2nd floor to find it totally empty of Thieves. The Amnish Centurion said to search the place for the key, which we did (due to the long-standing bug, 2 of the chests can only be opened via a Knock spell), but found none.
Okay, hmm... did you kill Larell or Renal (whoever was there) prior to trying this? The key spawns on them, but if they're dead... yeh. I'm guessing that might be what you've run into.
No--my order of operations was this: Get back from Underdark, get accosted by a Messenger who asked us to go see Brega, kill a few Githyanki, decant my Bag of Holding into the various containers of the 1st floor of the Guild, sell off what remained, run off to Brega, accept his quest, come back and massacre. Now, before I go see Brega, Renal's old guards and Larell are hanging out on the 2nd floor. After returning from Brega, the 2nd floor is completely abandoned.
Giving the key to the current head of that branch of the Guild (be that Renal or Larell) is a good thing, but only if you also remember to spawn that head into the new area after the map change.

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Oh--correction to my previous post: It was in Chapter 3 that we killed Mae'Var. And I forgot to add that Larell had nothing to say to us, ever. He just kept turning around to always be facing whatever party member was nearest to him, as if he was almost, but not quite, initiating conversation. This makes me think that he was essentially fake-talking himself, which is why he could never go Hostile.
So you betrayed Renal, killed Mae'Var, then went to speak to Larell? For lack of a better solution, killing Mae'Var when Larell's in power should really spawn STDEATH I guess, since it's the equivalent of killing Renal when you've done his quest.
The only time I killed Renal and saw Larell was on a pure bugtesting run: "I then Saved, and attacked Renal to test his difficulty, getting around Arkanis Gath by Ctrl-Qing and booting him." This is not the sort of thing that you leave as part of your game (since it means you just screwed yourself out of a legal way to get to Spellhold), this is the sort of thing that you try just to see what happens, and then Reload afterwards. :) Which I did.

So, a refresher: In Chapter 3, I sided with Aran, accepted Renal's quest, killed Mae'Var, got the reward from Renal, and did all of Aran's quests. Larell never appeared, nor was he even mentioned. No further Shadow Thief activities of interest.
In Chapter 6, the events that I noted in my "Some new bugs to report" post transpired.

[ADD:] New bug: If you kill Aran before you answer the summons to go see Brega, Brega has apparently lost all memory of the job he wanted you do do in the first place. I think a "We have already done this" conversation thread is in order here, perhaps with a slight penalty to the gold, EXP or possible items you would have gotten as a reward if you had been acting in a more official capacity.

On the Shadow Thieves turning hostile: I don't like the way that I practically have to Fail a Pickpocket on all of them to get them to fight back, but I do like the way that Marina (the Black Market Thief that's "adapted" via Rogue Rebalancing) can be kept alive and friendly even after you've killed everyone else, simply because I think it's so darn handy to have your own personal store right inside the front door of your stronghold.
Not even bad Pickpocketing is enough to turn Larell hostile, although I have found what does: Going into Stealth or Invisibility long enough for him to forget who he was talking to, then attacking him. May require multiple iterations.
« Last Edit: January 22, 2005, 10:56:22 PM by SixOfSpades »

Offline SixOfSpades

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Re: Thief-related stuff
« Reply #8 on: January 28, 2005, 07:04:16 PM »
New Weirdness: I went back to the game that I'd Saved right after getting back to Athkatla in Chapter 6. I then said, "Hey, screw Athkatla for a while, I'm gonna go do Watcher's Keep." So I did, and encountered Improved Fire Giants for the first time. Gee--five Lower Fire Resistances (area-of-effect), a Summon Greater Fire Elemental, an Improved Haste, and a Fire Storm.....all within a single round, and of course the Fire Giant is bashing away at us the whole time. Say goodbye, Improved Fire Giants. While I was uninstalling, I also decided to chuck out Improved Undead and I think a couple of other 'cheating' components.

When I got done with that, I loaded up my old Save (just got back to Athkatla, hadn't done anything except kill some Githyanki), and decided to mess with the Shadow Thieves again, for old time's sake. I went down to talk to Aran....and the "plot on your life from Larell & Mae'Var" line did NOT appear this time. Piqued, I went upstairs.....and there was Renal, right where he was supposed to be, and with no sign of Larell.

So.....uninstalling parts of Tactics corrects QP bugs? Curious.
I'll continue probing this, with emphasis on the Brega angle.

Offline SixOfSpades

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Re: Thief-related stuff
« Reply #9 on: January 30, 2005, 12:33:39 PM »
Cause of Tactics weirdness discovered, though hardly understood.

I went to talk to Brega, and he had no knowledge of asking me to see him, even though I pulled out my Journal and showed him the "Summoned to see Brega" entry. Perturbed, I then went back to chat with Aran.....which is when I noticed that the Mage that he gets as backup in Chapter 6 was not present. A nagging thought twitched at the back of my mind, and so I went back up to the ground floor, attacked a random Shadow Thief....causing all the others to turn Hostile immediately, and Marina to Dimension Door away. In short, uninstalling those Tactics components (Fire Giants, Undead, Bodhi, Mind Flayers, Beholders, Demons) seemed to uninstall Quest Pack as well.

So I went down into the Temple Sewers. Hmmm.....Jadarath's still there.

So I ran Setup-D0Quest again. All the components I'd chosen (I skipped Hell Trials & Improved Oasis because I already had them) asked if I wanted to RE-Install, but Additional Shadow Thieves Content just asked if I wanted to Install. So that was the weirdness.

After installing it again, I am returned to the bugs I've grown to know and love: Larell's back where Renal should be, I can warn Aran of a plot on his life when I have no inkling of such a thing, and there's no Renal (or anyone else on the 2nd floor) to kill so I can get the Guildhouse Key. Ahhh, nostalgia. At least Brega does what he's supposed to (although he forgets having sent for you if you've already killed Aran, just like before).
« Last Edit: January 30, 2005, 12:38:21 PM by SixOfSpades »

Offline SixOfSpades

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Re: Thief-related stuff
« Reply #10 on: January 30, 2005, 10:52:48 PM »
Addendum: It isn't killing Aran that makes Brega rescind his offer to let you spearhead the attack on the SThieves, it's either completing Aran's quest to kill Mae'Var/Larell, or killing him/them and then attacking Aran as well. (Apparently, killing a Thief renders you ineligible to kill more Thieves.) Which means that, as long as you don't actually talk to Aran after warning him of the threat to his life, you can kill the entire population of the building, go talk to Brega, and then kill them all over again a second time. Which, as Qwinn already noted in his thread, nets the player a duplicate Amulet of Power & RoP+2. One additional Bodhi reference that needs to be excised is that talking to Tizzak will update "Perform Bodhi's tasks to recieve her aid" in your Journal.

Aran & Co. were far too easy, I don't think he or his Mage cast a single worthwhile spell. The most powerful move they played in the fight was one of the Priests of Mask getting off a Flamestrike.

Brega's quest could include a "maybe later" as well as a "yes, we will," and "no, we won't." His "quest completes, here's your EXP" speech is well done, though. Makes me wonder if he's going to ask us to do more jobs for him.....perhaps he might point the party toward the Fallen Paladins quest, if you haven't already done so by x days.

I experienced a curious bug just now.....probably a one-time fluke, but I'll report it here just to be thorough. After I wiped out the Shadow Thief building (for the 2nd time), I went to the Graveyard District to see if the assassins I'd asked Aran for would show up, despite the fact that I'd just killed their boss twice. For some reason, the game didn't know what chapter it was. Bodhi & her Vampires didn't show up the moment I entered the map, the Chapter 6 entrance to her lair was "barred from the inside," and the Chapter 3 entrances had not "been deliberately collapsed." Curious, I went down and explored, and found the Chapter 3 Lair, not a Vampire to be seen. I then Reloaded my Auto-Save, and Bodhi & Friends immediately popped up, and the game was back in Chapter 6 again. Weird. Probably caused by the fact that I arrived in the Graveyard District only a few minutes before midnight, so the game probably neglected the "advance timer to midnight, run Chapter 6 scripts" commands.
« Last Edit: February 01, 2005, 12:31:24 AM by SixOfSpades »

Offline SimDing0™

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Re: Thief-related stuff
« Reply #11 on: February 02, 2005, 06:54:55 AM »
Okay, I *think* I've fixed the issue whereby... the whole thing went horribly wrong (all that stuff with Larell spawning in randomly, Brega forgetting who you are, and such). Fingers crossed. I'm testing it out myself right now.

Aran & Co. were far too easy, I don't think he or his Mage cast a single worthwhile spell. The most powerful move they played in the fight was one of the Priests of Mask getting off a Flamestrike.
Will try to beef him up. He was supposed to buff up as you worked your way through the area towards him, and he should have had some Minute Meteors by the time you got there, but I'm... not sure it worked. Gah.

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Brega's quest could include a "maybe later" as well as a "yes, we will," and "no, we won't." His "quest completes, here's your EXP" speech is well done, though. Makes me wonder if he's going to ask us to do more jobs for him.....perhaps he might point the party toward the Fallen Paladins quest, if you haven't already done so by x days.
Will add the extra dialogue option. And I think you read my mind so far as him directing you to the Fallen Paladins goes. :)

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I experienced a curious bug just now.....probably a one-time fluke, but I'll report it here just to be thorough. After I wiped out the Shadow Thief building (for the 2nd time), I went to the Graveyard District to see if the assassins I'd asked Aran for would show up, despite the fact that I'd just killed their boss twice. For some reason, the game didn't know what chapter it was. Bodhi & her Vampires didn't show up the moment I entered the map, the Chapter 6 entrance to her lair was "barred from the inside," and the Chapter 3 entrances had not "been deliberately collapsed." Curious, I went down and explored, and found the Chapter 3 Lair, not a Vampire to be seen. I then Reloaded my Auto-Save, and Bodhi & Friends immediately popped up, and the game was back in Chapter 6 again. Weird. Probably caused by the fact that I arrived in the Graveyard District only a few minutes before midnight, so the game probably neglected the "advance timer to midnight, run Chapter 6 scripts" commands.
I can't think that's anything I've done. Unless anyone else has the same experience, I'll just write it off as One Of Those Things BG2 Does Sometimes.

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Re: Thief-related stuff
« Reply #12 on: February 02, 2005, 12:32:32 PM »
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"For some reason, the game didn't know what chapter it was. Bodhi & her Vampires didn't show up the moment I entered the map, the Chapter 6 entrance to her lair was "barred from the inside," and the Chapter 3 entrances had not "been deliberately collapsed." Curious, I went down and explored, and found the Chapter 3 Lair, not a Vampire to be seen. I then Reloaded my Auto-Save, and Bodhi & Friends immediately popped up, and the game was back in Chapter 6 again. Weird. Probably caused by the fact that I arrived in the Graveyard District only a few minutes before midnight, so the game probably neglected the "advance timer to midnight, run Chapter 6 scripts" commands."

I can't think that's anything I've done. Unless anyone else has the same experience, I'll just write it off as One Of Those Things BG2 Does Sometimes.

Um, erm, I had the same thing happen  :-\  I found, indeed, that I was able to go to the graveyard in full daylight in Chapter 6, at which point everything was still Chapter 3ish.  I had to rest until nighttime in order to get the Chapter 6 plot to initiate.  I just assumed that in prior games I had just coincidentally always gone to the graveyard at night, but if there was indeed an "advance timer to midnight" script in place (and I'm leaning toward agreeing there was since I never noticed this issue before, I've played through enough times that it'd be a pretty big coincidence that I always went at night), it's not working now.  Speculation - is it possible that it's linked to the appearance of the "Kiss before dying" NPC in the graveyard?  And what's the point of her not showing up until Chapter 6, anyway?  Did I miss something that explains that?

Qwinn
« Last Edit: February 02, 2005, 12:55:42 PM by Qwinn »

Offline SixOfSpades

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Re: Thief-related stuff
« Reply #13 on: February 02, 2005, 01:37:04 PM »
At first I thought that Dahlia was postponed until Chapter 6 because having her there in Chapters 2-3 would mean an alternate way to get a Necklace of Talos, which could make the Thief quest too easy (in a sense). But then I remembered that there's nothing preventing the party from doing the Thief quest in Chapter 6 anyway.

I think you're on the right track with Dahlia--perhaps the command to place her somehow overrides the "advance timer to midnight" command, so the Graveyard District is stuck in Chapter 3 until you're aboveground exactly at midnight. (And yes, the game does advange the clock. Another instance of this is leaving Irenicus's Dungeon: It's always Hour 7 when you leave.)

Offline SimDing0™

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Re: Thief-related stuff
« Reply #14 on: February 26, 2005, 07:21:45 AM »
I *think* I've fixed the graveyard issue, but I'll have to check ingame. BG2 area scripts suck. :(

For lack of a better solution, I'll remove the Necklace of Talos. There's no real reason for her having it anyway.

Offline underdog

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Re: Thief-related stuff
« Reply #15 on: February 28, 2005, 03:38:38 PM »
Dahlia, is that lady standing around wanting someone to kiss her?
I sent minsc to talk to her ,(hey *I* wasn't going to kiss her), he kissed her and she just walked off, is that
what she was supposed to do?

And whats with Arkanis Gath, is he a stock person,
Cleared out the thieves guild per Brega, if I try to walk by there to get to
say Cromwell's the last thief outside attacks, then Gath show up and kills 3-5 characters in <1 second
he hist does 10 points damage and they die, and he's unkillable.

!lanimret siht edisni deppart ma I !pleH

 

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