Archived Posts - Slavers/Twisted Rune/Guarded Compound

[Reverendratbastard]

- The mages who were hired by Baron Ployer (Jaheira's Curse) ... they had strange robes, so maybe they were Twisted Rune wizards?  I never got the chance to ask the clerks about them, they just (conveniently) appeared for me outside the Council of Six building.  Maybe they didn't want me asking....Hmm.

  they're mercenaries, and imo not powerful enough to be hanging around with liches and beholders (and certainly not secretive or greedy enough, although i don't recall an excuse for why the cowlies don't react to them at all - small potatoes, perhaps?)

- Who were those assassins and mages protecting Reijek Hidesman and why were they there? (Skinner Murders)

  well, the assassins are called 'Rune Assassins'...   and the mage {singular} babbles about hidesman's great work that you have disrupted...
  and Rejiek's contact can mention the Rune even before you bring him his key ingredient.  (perhaps only if you denounce his request)

- The extended Tanner quest makes you buy a book (History of the Zhentarim... hmm.. maybe I should ask Xzar if he is tied in with the Rune as well) and meet Reijek's contact.  A pointless quest unless it actually led to the Twisted Rune.

it was supposed to, but vanilla-wise has only human skin armor to show for itself.  which many do consider pointless, even setting aside the risk involved.

- What the hell was Mekrath doing in the sewers?  Was he there to provide protection for the mind flayers who lived next door?

 he just has stairs that go down to the sewers.  i'm sure a lot of property owners in the city have those.  that an imp stole his mirror and fled down those stairs doesn't make him 'suspiciously' connected to the sewers.  you might as well ask 'what the hell is mekrath doing in the bridge district?' because part of his home overlooks it.  wait, the rune-house {entrance, at least} is at the other end of the bridge!  coincidence? 
 plus which any one of those illithid (or more likely an ulitharid) could wipe the walls with mekrath.  they don't exactly need protection.
 then again, perhaps the Gem has potential to inhibit/influence astral travel or something.  but i think in that case they'd take it from him or destroy it, rather than rely on his use of it / wait for gith to snatch it.

 all this 'neighbor' stuff (as with jysstev/deril later) is just a blend of too few maps, each of which are crowded, and lazy design imo.  some coincidences are fun, but they lose sinister qualities in the light of everything being as streamlined as it is.

- Tazok was found in Firkraag's Lair (obviously now employed by Firky) so WHAT is Firkraag's connection to the Twisted Rune?

  this seems to be implying that tazok has a connection to the Rune... 

  i think most of your concerns have already been addressed, either by ub itself or by topic flurries all over the place.  doubtless someone with more exposure to both will point a more helpful finger soon.

[Kai of CandleKeep]

i think most of your concerns have already been addressed, either by ub itself or by topic flurries all over the place.  doubtless someone with more exposure to both will point a more helpful finger soon.

I think I'm just in love with the whole "super-conspiracy-theory" idea     

[Reverendratbastard]

i think most of your concerns have already been addressed, either by ub itself or by topic flurries all over the place.  doubtless someone with more exposure to both will point a more helpful finger soon.

I think I'm just in love with the whole "super-conspiracy-theory" idea     

  you and me both.    but these folks already have SO much work to do, i try to balance it between spouting notions and trimming 'em down.

[Neffra]

What would be funny, but no less insane, would be someone 20 years from now finding ancient top-SEKRIT Interplay interoffice memos stating that the designers never intended on any of this stuff linking up, but they just tossed in some semi-suspicious, conspiracy lookin' bits and parts and then sat back to laugh their asses off when players and Moddars alike tried to figure out what the designers were smokin' or drinkin' when they wrote the game up. Now THAT is a conspiracy.

[Andyr]

The Twisted Rune is meant to be an incredibly secret organisation, with only the half-dozen or so Undead at the top and a literal hanful of associates knowing they even exist. Hundreds of people work for them without even realising it.

Getting into the compound with the Rogue Stone and stumbling upon them is pretty (un?)lucky, but I'd imagine they'd cover their tracks well enough that even if all these conspiracy theories were true then the player would still have almost no chance of ever finding out about it.

As a result, I personally am against tying everything into one massive Twisted Rune plot that the player can discover.

[jester]

The good thing about the TR is that future mods can use the loose ends as a tie-in to hint at an involvement without pieces never really having to match. That is the whole point of a conspiracy, Mr. Ryan.

[Neffra]

I agree about the Twisted Rune wholeheartedly. Making the whole thing tie in to one huge quest is taking it a bit too far. The TR is the most secretive organization in the Realms with suspected ties/members in the actual Council of Six. They cover their bases far too well for so many people to know who they are and what they are. Also... given what I know of the Rune, petty slavery isn't really what that organization is about. They're about infiltrating a government from the inside and taking it over without anyone being the wiser. Canon info in the Lands of Intrigue manual mentions that they're in Amn/Athkatla to do just that: Get into the ruling body and slowly take over, replacing the Council with their own puppets.

That's not to say that certain members of the Rune can't BE slavers, because I'm sure there are lots, but most of these lower level peons don't have a clue who they're working for ultimately and are likely going by their own agendas when it comes right down to it. Slavery = money.

[Murdane]

As a result, I personally am against tying everything into one massive Twisted Rune plot that the player can discover.

I agree, for the reasons both you and Neffra already mentioned.

[Reverendratbastard]

The TR is the most secretive organization in the Realms . . .

  sounds like a smokescreen to me. 
  i would expect the most secretive organization in the Realms[/b](!) to be something whose name is not known, especially to the point of there being any theories as to particular governmental institutions which its influence reaches.

[Murdane]

The TR is the most secretive organization in the Realms . . .

  sounds like a smokescreen to me. 
  i would expect the most secretive organization in the Realms[/b](!) to be something whose name is not known, especially to the point of there being any theories as to particular governmental institutions which its influence reaches.

Well, it would be known to players, but not necessarily to characters and PCs.

There are plenty of things that we know but our characters are not privy to.

[NiGHTMARE]

The TR doesn't have any members on the Council of Six (at least, none of the sourcebooks say they do), though that doesn't mean the Amnish government doesn't feel the Rune's influence.

[FluffigtDjur]

SOME kind of hint that going into that particular door would pitch you against powerful evil would be nice though... I always feel like a naughty power-gamer when I go fishing for my Staff of the magi . It's just too convenient to stumble in there. Anyway I say: Link it to Gaxxy... He's damn powerful AND undead... connection enough I say.

[NiGHTMARE]

I always thought that Kangaxx would predate the Twisted Rune: as a demi-lich, Kangaxx has probably been around for well over a millenia, whereas the Twisted Rune is "only" five centuries old.  I suppose it depends how much of his existence he spent trapped in a tomb.

[underdog]

  sounds like a smokescreen to me. 
  i would expect the most secretive organization in the Realms[/b](!) to be something whose name is not known, especially to the point of there being any theories as to particular governmental institutions which its influence reaches.

TR is the front for them, their real name is  'thwak' agggh Ggrrrggghh, 'thud'.

[FluffigtDjur]

I always thought that Kangaxx would predate the Twisted Rune: as a demi-lich, Kangaxx has probably been around for well over a millenia, whereas the Twisted Rune is "only" five centuries old.  I suppose it depends how much of his existence he spent trapped in a tomb.

Yeah he might be old but he is powerful enough to mess around with them... maybe get trapped as an result... I mean if he spit out some lines about wanting to hunt down old "friends" in the twisted rune in between the mad laughter, would you doubt him? So what if he's older then the organization, doesn't mean the people IN the organization haven't been unalive as long as he has.

Think about it, if you want to take over the world from the shadows, the last thing you want is some mad brother-in-undeath to start an apocalypse... there would be nothing left to rule, yes?

[SixOfSpades]

.... their real name is  'thwak' agggh Ggrrrggghh, 'thud'.

"He must have died while writing it!"
"Oh, COME on! He wouldn't bother to WRITE 'thwak' agggh Ggrrrggghh, 'thud,' he'd just SAY it!"
"Well, that's what's written on the note!"
(sorry.)

Yeah he might be old but he is powerful enough to mess around with them... maybe get trapped as an result... I mean if he spit out some lines about wanting to hunt down old "friends" in the twisted rune in between the mad laughter, would you doubt him? So what if he's older then the organization, doesn't mean the people IN the organization haven't been unalive as long as he has.

Except that Kangaxx's adversaries are already identified in-game as being (Good- or Neutral-aligned) Liches of Netheril. Which means that Kangaxx has been imprisoned for, what, 5 or 6 times as long as the TR has been known to exist? Something like that, I've no clear idea of when Netheril was supposed to have fallen. (I once had a link to a website that featured the entire Roll of Years, but of course I seem to have lost / deleted it. Clever me.)

[NiGHTMARE]

The oldest member of the Rune is a 1,200 year old dracolich.  Their next two eldest members are both over 800 years old, being a lich and a vampire respectively.

[FluffigtDjur]

hehe this is what I get for trying to make a story line in a game that involves Ad&d.

hm, right... what about Gaxxy sensing powerful undead close by and needing something to draw power from... His been trapped for a millennium I guess he isn't juiced up completely yet... some lame adventurers wouldn't be able to stop him if he was 100% back in business, yes? What say you, rule book guys?

[SixOfSpades]

Random Thought: Is a Lich's age calculated from the date of birth, or the date of Undeath? It'd be kinda weird to see an Elven Lich making fun of all the "young, upstart whippersnapper" Human Liches.

[Andyr]

I'd say age of birth.

Though in the case of human liches, the 'alive' portion could be pretty small.

[NiGHTMARE]

An elven lich (also known as a baelnorn) would probably prefer to kill all the human liches rather than comment on their age, since the former tend to be good and the latter tend to be evil .

IIRC there is an evil half-elven lich in the Rune though.  As I mentioned in my previous post a dracolich (i.e. a dragon lich) is their eldest member (but not their leader), and they also have a tiefling lich .

[Andyr]

Good/Evil lich discussion moved here: http://forums.pocketplane.net/index.php?topic=18416.0

[The_Swordalizer]

The one quest in SoA that I always thought leaped out at me as being half finished was the Twisted Rune.

Now I know this was dismissed (very briefly) in the "suggested components" thread  , but I think it is blindingly obvious that much more was meant for this element of the game.

Exhibit A: All the guarded compound guys have .dlg files mentioned in their .cre files that don't exist (which makes them very easy to mod dialog for!).

Exhibit B: Shangalar mentions Koshi in his dialog, yet nowhere else is this connection mentioned.

Exhibit C: A variable is set in the guarded compund, something like "KnowsRuneHQLocation".

Exhibit D: All the guys in the GC and the Rune HQ are named, even though you only meet them once and they are never mentioned anywhere else.

Exhibit E: Koshi has the Rogue Stone enticing you to the Rune HQ, which is the most blatant "Oh look we don't have time to finish this quest. Lets stick in a few items to lead the player along" in the game.

Please, don't dismiss this as being "Not UB". By every definition of Unfinished this quest comes out top!!

[Andyr]

This has been discussed in another thread, but here are my thoughts in brief:

- The Koshi rogue stone stuff is Baldurdash or something, not original game content. I don't remember Koshi in Shangalar's dialogue, but if so it is probably also Baldurdash.

- The Twisted Rune are probably the most secretive secret society in Faerun. It is silly how you stumble upon them. And also how those you find inside happen to be some of the leaders of the Rune, who could probably defeat the PC and party without much trouble, and would just teleport away if not.

- DLG files being referenced are one thing but having nothing in them means we've got nothing to go on.

- In short, I don't want to restore anything. If there was a plot, the absence of much stuff remaining ingame means it was likely cut fairly early on down to the encounter you now get. Which I think is a silly encounter, but never mind. I don't think it counts as solvable UB.

[CamDawg]

The rogue stone is added by Baldurdash, as is the Isaea Roenall connection. Shangalar's dialogue is also altered to mention Koshi.