Author Topic: Valen's Final Death  (Read 15360 times)

T.G.Maestro

  • Guest
Valen's Final Death
« on: April 15, 2003, 01:13:19 PM »
Maybe it was discussed before (hell again, I'm lazy to look at it too much :huh:  :lol: ), but I think some changes could be done about her Final Death.
First of all, she is a Vampire, and not a simple Zombie. The later would really die the FD if killed, because of his undead shell is destroyed. But since Valen is a Vampire, it seems absolutely nonsense, that she simply DIES after struck down. In the "Final Re-balancing" thread people keep talkin about she should remain as she is, because any change on her would make her differ from a normal Vampire. Now, I'm asking, what's the dealk this time? Her Final Death is everything, but realistic. Noemally she should turn into gaseous form, and flee the area to recover somewhere safe.
Here comes a little idea (as I recall, it was already mentioned somewhere): is it possible, that every time she "dies" (as she reaches 1 Hp), she would turn into gas and disappear. After this she would respawn in the graveyard district, for example in one of the tombs (this one should be Valens tomb). If the party would like to get her back, you would only need to go to the Graveyards and ask her to rejoin.
I think this would make her character more interesting, and would solve the annoyance of her FD.

Comments?
« Last Edit: April 15, 2003, 01:13:42 PM by T.G.Maestro »

Guest

  • Guest
Valen's Final Death
« Reply #1 on: April 15, 2003, 01:16:40 PM »
jep, sound good. but when valen remains in daylight and is about to die she should really die, i think.

Seifer

  • Guest
Valen's Final Death
« Reply #2 on: April 15, 2003, 01:20:12 PM »
That does have a good foundation as Valen doesnt appear to have any type of crypt at all in the game.  However, the graveyard isnt always a viable option IMO as large parts of the game render this inacessible.

What may be a better option is adding a quest or whatever so she can establish a crypt in majot cities or parts of the game for instance, a tower in the Underdark etc.

T.G.Maestro

  • Guest
Valen's Final Death
« Reply #3 on: April 15, 2003, 01:30:12 PM »
Good idea Seifer.
-In Amn, the Graveyard should suffice (the tomb with the Shadow Fiends and the Mummy would fit her perfect)
-In Brynnlaw there could be a tomb in the courteesans hideout.
-In the Sahaugin city her tomb could be placed in the Sea Zombie Lord lair.
-In the Underdark the collapsed Swirfneblin tunnel would be fine.
-In Saradush the Vampire tunnels are ideal.
-In Amkethran you could use Vangoethe's lair.
 

Guest

  • Guest
Valen's Final Death
« Reply #4 on: April 15, 2003, 01:30:20 PM »
hmmmm.... a coffin she carrys with her.
in the first chapter it is in the graveyard, then when she moves to the underdark she can carry it with her. then until underdark, death means death cause the coffin isnt placed anywhere. in the underdark she can place it in the lair of the dragon or in the snirf village.
yeah, okay, stupid idea. why not place the coffin somewhere before any fight.

T.G.Maestro

  • Guest
Valen's Final Death
« Reply #5 on: April 15, 2003, 01:31:42 PM »
Read my suggestions above ;)  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  

Guest

  • Guest
Valen's Final Death
« Reply #6 on: April 15, 2003, 01:33:16 PM »
upsi. ;-)

T.G.Maestro

  • Guest
Valen's Final Death
« Reply #7 on: April 20, 2003, 11:47:44 AM »
Any "official" comments? Could these things be made, or is it only a (bad :) ) dream?

necro

  • Guest
Valen's Final Death
« Reply #8 on: April 21, 2003, 08:37:39 AM »
yeah, i think this is implementable. perhaps the master could answer, please. ;-)

Thorium Dragon

  • Guest
Valen's Final Death
« Reply #9 on: September 20, 2003, 11:30:22 AM »
Perhaps instead of a grave to retreat to upon being "killed", she could retreat to a magical urn the PC carries. The urn can be reopened in a couple of days and Valen reforms.

This would solve the exploit of monsters persistently attacking the unkillable gaseous form. This penalizes the player for allowing her to "die" as she would be unavailable for a time.

Also, if it happens often enough, Valen could get annoyed with the PC, leave the party, attack the PC, ect.
 
« Last Edit: September 20, 2003, 11:21:55 PM by Thorium Dragon »

T.G.Maestro

  • Guest
Valen's Final Death
« Reply #10 on: September 22, 2003, 08:09:24 AM »
Quote
Perhaps instead of a grave to retreat to upon being "killed", she could retreat to a magical urn the PC carries. The urn can be reopened in a couple of days and Valen reforms.

This would solve the exploit of monsters persistently attacking the unkillable gaseous form.
A good idea, but it won't do anything with the gaseous form ability, since it is triggered when Valen gets hurt too badly, not when she is already dead.
Summoning her from the urn could be a 1/day ability.

Thorium Dragon

  • Guest
Valen's Final Death
« Reply #11 on: September 22, 2003, 11:50:35 AM »
Could a script could be written to have Valen, upon being reduced to 1 hp, turn gaseous, move to the PC's location and/or then dissappear?

I imagine it could be, as I've seen these things occur separatly throughout the game.

If this were implemented I would say she would have to spend at least 3 days in the urn "healing" until she can reform again.  (You have to give the PC some penalty for getting her "killled" <note quotes>  ;)  )  

Schatten

  • Guest
Valen's Final Death
« Reply #12 on: September 23, 2003, 09:34:06 AM »
Quote
Could a script could be written to have Valen, upon being reduced to 1 hp, turn gaseous, move to the PC's location and/or then dissappear?

I imagine it could be, as I've seen these things occur separatly throughout the game.

If this were implemented I would say she would have to spend at least 3 days in the urn "healing" until she can reform again.  (You have to give the PC some penalty for getting her "killled" <note quotes>  ;)  )
good idea and it is doable.
perhaps you can script it like a familiar when it jumps in your backpack. but 3days is way to much. 1day should be sufficient.
"but it won't do anything with the gaseous form ability, since it is triggered when Valen gets hurt too badly, not when she is already dead"
you can modify that. just modify the trigger to when she has only 1 hp like the enemy vamps.

but i fear the great master wont answer to it. :(

Offline Grim Squeaker

  • Fallen
  • Planewalker
  • *****
  • Posts: 1019
  • Gender: Male
Valen's Final Death
« Reply #13 on: September 23, 2003, 11:08:00 AM »
You could have her reform at night fall.  If its already night then have her return a couple of hours later.
"You alone can make my song take flight..."

Necrontyr

  • Guest
Valen's Final Death
« Reply #14 on: October 05, 2003, 09:16:39 AM »
The urn could be full of earth from whereever she was sired. I think that's the myth anyway (that vamp's coffin's contain earth from them home).

Auvrin

  • Guest
Valen's Final Death
« Reply #15 on: October 05, 2003, 10:48:25 PM »
Quote
But 3days is way to much. 1day should be sufficient.

I agree with the 3 days actually.  Teaches people to be more careful with their characters.

reiella

  • Guest
Valen's Final Death
« Reply #16 on: October 06, 2003, 04:00:05 PM »
Quote
Quote
But 3days is way to much. 1day should be sufficient.

I agree with the 3 days actually.  Teaches people to be more careful with their characters.
Although, on that, you have the odd balancing act of something being just pest/inconvienance versus "Enough of a trouble to bother to reload".

The big reason Valen's Final Death doesn't end up being much of a 'balance' issue is because people will quite easily reload if that situation occurs (although it is still a loss of time).

1 day would probably see a bit more 'use' than 3 days is my point :).

Auvrin

  • Guest
Valen's Final Death
« Reply #17 on: October 06, 2003, 06:26:03 PM »
Quote
1 day would probably see a bit more 'use' than 3 days is my point


Then I guess that point doesn't matter, because most of those people that would reload do it anyways when a character dies.  :rolleyes:  

Schatten

  • Guest
Valen's Final Death
« Reply #18 on: October 07, 2003, 04:22:45 AM »
if it takes three days for her to recover i would surely reload. if it is only 1 day it isnt so much of a bother. :)

HardenCoonor

  • Guest
Valen's Final Death
« Reply #19 on: October 20, 2003, 09:35:35 AM »
Why thinking about days? Maybe the PC has to get hold of something innocent, a child or a neutral bystander to get Valen back, or back faster.  Maybe some dialog-option with the urn, where Valen/the urn randomly chooses a kind of creature(man, elf, orc, silver dragon, whatever) to be sacrificed to get Valen back.

If days, 2 or 3 would make sense to me, with Valen being greyed out(dead party member) to prevent exploits e.g. wit hthe paladin's quests.

The gaseous form would turn to that person in battle that has the urn, and when reaching that person, it disappears, dropping all items Valen was carrying. The urn should be like Boo to Minsc, hardlinked (to the PC), maybe droppable if the PC is really mean, something like

1. I open the urn and the dust of Valen's immortal body falls to the ground.
2. Talk to Valen in the urn.

if 2 -> Valen: I need the blood of 3 Kuo-Toa or some icecream to heal my wounds.

Thorium Dragon

  • Guest
Valen's Final Death
« Reply #20 on: October 20, 2003, 05:22:43 PM »
Quote
... Maybe the PC has to get hold of something innocent, a child or a neutral bystander to get Valen back, or back faster.  Maybe some dialog-option with the urn, where Valen/the urn randomly chooses a kind of creature(man, elf, orc, silver dragon, whatever) to be sacrificed...
Sounds a bit complex, I think.

I proposed the urn solution to overcome the obstacles of her dying in, say, the Abyss where her grave is unreachable.  Having to kill a kuo-tua would recreate this problem if the character was finished with the Underdark.

HardenCoonor

  • Guest
Valen's Final Death
« Reply #21 on: October 24, 2003, 10:21:27 AM »
Quote
Sounds a bit complex, I think.

Definetly. It was meant to. And Kuo Toa you can always find in the underdark. They spawn again and again. Even in the area where you can access Suldanessalar you can find them.

And killing a specific creature is maybe just to get her back faster, not needed to get her back at all. Maybe with creature instantly, without creature 10 or more days. Unfortunately bg2 and soa are not that time-sensitive, so waiting for 10 days is affordable without suffering penalties in battles, group-members leaving or similar things.

T.G.Maestro

  • Guest
Valen's Final Death
« Reply #22 on: October 31, 2003, 06:43:16 AM »
Anyway, the debate is pointless unless there is someone (other than the author) who can implement these changes. Valen mod won't be changed by Weimer in the future I guess.

Schatten

  • Guest
Valen's Final Death
« Reply #23 on: October 31, 2003, 04:11:09 PM »
true. its really sad bvecause here are some good ideas. :(
it seems none of wes mods get any changes besides bug fixes. :(

Auvrin

  • Guest
Valen's Final Death
« Reply #24 on: October 31, 2003, 11:21:05 PM »
Sola has gotten a great deal of changes.  I personally wouldn't blame him for not responding to every single person who decides to suggest changing his mods all together and/or adding a great deal more to them.

It shouldn't be expected for someone who made something of their own accord, own free time, and own ideas, to alter/add/extend their mods by request of people who paid nothing for it.  Bug fixing is an added bonus, and THAT shouldn't even be expected.  I'm sure you didn't mean it like that, but well.. That's how you said it.

He's got a life, and from what has been said, he's aiming for a PHD.  That is by no means easy, and not something a person would want to blow off to make other people they don't even know happy.

Again, free is free.  Don't insult a gift giver, wether it was intended or not.

 

With Quick-Reply you can write a post when viewing a topic without loading a new page. You can still use bulletin board code and smileys as you would in a normal post.

Warning: this topic has not been posted in for at least 120 days.
Unless you're sure you want to reply, please consider starting a new topic.

Name: Email:
Verification:
Type the letters shown in the picture
Listen to the letters / Request another image
Type the letters shown in the picture:
What color is grass?:
What is the seventh word in this sentence?:
What is five minus two (use the full word)?: