Pocket Plane Group

BG1 Completed Mods => The Fields of the Dead => Topic started by: Fatal Error on May 28, 2005, 07:35:32 PM

Title: Tarnesh AI/ Various early game comments and questions
Post by: Fatal Error on May 28, 2005, 07:35:32 PM
I was disappointed with the actions of Tarnesh - he just stood where he was originally found which allowed my group the opportunity to duck around the corner, stealth Monty and backstab the mage at my leisure. It didn't kill him outright but it nearly did. Tarnesh hit Monty with a Color Spray which could have been deadly had it hit the entire group rather than just Monty who of course was on the other side of Tarnesh.

Should Tarnesh approach the group? I think it would be more of a challenge if he did.

Reevor's rats, OTOH, gave me a few worrisome moments. I'm glad I had impulse bought a helmet and sword (and I did that only because I noticed I didn't start with a staff) prior to combatting those rodents. Imoen did not have a wand of magic missles - is this a random happening or will she never start with the wand? And why take away Xzars Larloch's? I don't feel comfortable without having at least one guaranteed hit in the group. Is this the reason?
Title: Re: Tarnesh AI/ Various early game comments and questions
Post by: Echon on May 29, 2005, 03:13:14 AM
Enemies in general would be more challenging if they pursued the party. I did have such a system in the AI at one point but it slowed everything down and therefore it was removed. I could probably make a new and more effective one.

I removed the wand because I want as few magical items in the beginning of the game as possible. There are only a few potions now.

Xzar is missing Larloch's Minor Drain because I had removed it from the game for some time. When I reintroduced it I forgot to give it to him again but I will make sure he gets it.

-Echon
Title: Re: Tarnesh AI/ Various early game comments and questions
Post by: Salk on May 29, 2005, 06:47:20 AM
A new and more effective AI system which would include pursuing enemies and line of sight detection would boost the unicity and the quality (already extremely high) of this Mod so I 'd say it's definitely something to think about for the future. A important, giant step for its evolution... :pirate
Title: Re: Tarnesh AI/ Various early game comments and questions
Post by: ElfBane on May 29, 2005, 08:40:49 AM
I was disappointed with the actions of Tarnesh - he just stood where he was originally found which allowed my group the opportunity to duck around the corner, stealth Monty and backstab the mage at my leisure. It didn't kill him outright but it nearly did. Tarnesh hit Monty with a Color Spray which could have been deadly had it hit the entire group rather than just Monty who of course was on the other side of Tarnesh.

Should Tarnesh approach the group? I think it would be more of a challenge if he did.


Hmmm, isn't this Tarnesh's behavior in vanilla BG? I don't think Echon tinkered with this encounter.
Title: Re: Tarnesh AI/ Various early game comments and questions
Post by: Echon on May 29, 2005, 08:44:58 AM
Hmmm, isn't this Tarnesh's behavior in vanilla BG?

It is but this mod does aim to improve the AI. I believe it was a suggestion for an improvement.

-Echon
Title: Re: Tarnesh AI/ Various early game comments and questions
Post by: Fatal Error on May 30, 2005, 06:47:02 AM
I haven't progressed very far yet, as I'm only at Nashkel but I do have some more questions/comments. I looked to see if these had been previously asked though of course I may have missed them. Feel free to ignore them if they are particularly stupid ones.

-Are there any bucklers?
-Who identifies weapons/armor?
-Should Jaheira start the game with 0 XPs? I've had the impression that she was a more experienced adventurer than the others.
-Is the ring of wizardry, ankheg armor, (and I assume) cone of cold  - the "perk" items, to be found anywhere? I'm guessing they're gone like the wand of magic missles. That's fine, if it's the case, but it would be nice to know.
- About that fight with Tarnish again: I'm not sure if it was due to him staying at the top of the stairs and thus perhaps out of their sight or whether it was due to a change in their script (or really if I just imagined it) but I don't believe the FAI guards aided my group in their struggle against Tarnesh. Should they have? That is after all the Inn's one rule that Tarnnesh is breaking.
- A flat out spoiler here would be great - where is the History of the Fateful Coin?
Title: Re: Tarnesh AI/ Various early game comments and questions
Post by: Fatal Error on May 30, 2005, 06:54:43 AM
I was disappointed with the actions of Tarnesh - he just stood where he was originally found which allowed my group the opportunity to duck around the corner, stealth Monty and backstab the mage at my leisure. It didn't kill him outright but it nearly did. Tarnesh hit Monty with a Color Spray which could have been deadly had it hit the entire group rather than just Monty who of course was on the other side of Tarnesh.

Should Tarnesh approach the group? I think it would be more of a challenge if he did.


Hmmm, isn't this Tarnesh's behavior in vanilla BG? I don't think Echon tinkered with this encounter.

In the original game Tarnish approaches the group, casts mirror image image, then horror, then casts magic missle. In the FotD he simply stood at the spot where he first yelled at my group and never cast anything at all until after Mony had backstabbed him. Neira in Nashkel now also follows a similar standoffish approach.
Title: Re: Tarnesh AI/ Various early game comments and questions
Post by: Echon on May 30, 2005, 08:32:38 AM
-Are there any bucklers?

Most stores should have bucklers.

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-Who identifies weapons/armor?

Wizards. At this time in the game you will need to see Thalantyr in High Hedge.

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-Should Jaheira start the game with 0 XPs? I've had the impression that she was a more experienced adventurer than the others.

All NPCs join party at the same level as the PC. The backgrounds of some characters suggest that their minimal level should be higher than 1, though, but I think they should be kept at same level for consistency and balance.

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-Is the ring of wizardry, ankheg armor, (and I assume) cone of cold  - the "perk" items, to be found anywhere? I'm guessing they're gone like the wand of magic missles. That's fine, if it's the case, but it would be nice to know.

All the free magical items that dotted the landscape are gone now.

Quote
- About that fight with Tarnish again: I'm not sure if it was due to him staying at the top of the stairs and thus perhaps out of their sight or whether it was due to a change in their script (or really if I just imagined it) but I don't believe the FAI guards aided my group in their struggle against Tarnesh. Should they have? That is after all the Inn's one rule that Tarnnesh is breaking.

If they see him, they will help you.

Quote
- A flat out spoiler here would be great - where is the History of the Fateful Coin?

I am not sure really, I just removed the one from Whatshisname's Inn. There has to be a copy lying around somewhere.

-Echon
Title: Re: Tarnesh AI/ Various early game comments and questions
Post by: Borsook on May 30, 2005, 08:49:57 AM
Spoiler!


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- A flat out spoiler here would be great - where is the History of the Fateful Coin?


The book should be on the shelf in the house just next to the place where you've met Firebead Elvenhair have a look around...
Title: Re: Tarnesh AI/ Various early game comments and questions
Post by: LoOk on May 30, 2005, 01:18:52 PM
That ain't good in my opinion. Then you HAVE to steal and you don't roleplay then. Why did you remove the book from Feldepost's Inn anyway?
Title: Re: Tarnesh AI/ Various early game comments and questions
Post by: Echon on May 30, 2005, 02:27:44 PM
That ain't good in my opinion. Then you HAVE to steal and you don't roleplay then.

How exactly does stealing exclude roleplaying? Makes it a bit hard to play a thief, I think. Besides, there are probably copies of it elsewhere.

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Why did you remove the book from Feldepost's Inn anyway?

Why? Because it is not a quest when you do something the one who gave you the quest could easily have done himself. The party might as well be awarded the XP upon entering Beregost, the challenge involved is pretty much the same. At least now you actually have to search for a copy of it and earn the XP.

The *only* reason they placed the book there is because you have to give it to Firebead and I think it is stupid. Reminds me of how they placed normal weapons of all types before encountering magic golems in ToB.

-Echon
Title: Re: Tarnesh AI/ Various early game comments and questions
Post by: Fatal Error on May 30, 2005, 03:12:29 PM
Re: bucklers - Yep, you're right that they are there. I didn't realize it due to their being redded out and unusable to my bard. Jaheira is not allowed a helmet... that's a statement more than a question because I assume that she's not meant to have a helmet. I just experienced a random encounter with a bear and it appeared that it wouldn't switch off its initial target under any circumstance. It makes it very easy to kill. Re: the Fateful Coin - I've always just assumed that E knew where it was and gave the "quest" because a) he is a lazy mage and didn't want to get it himself or b) wanted to see if charname possessed a proper amount of "wax on/wax off" humility.  ;) But I don't mind that it's gone.



 
Title: Re: Tarnesh AI/ Various early game comments and questions
Post by: Borsook on May 30, 2005, 03:18:53 PM
@Echon
I'd disagree with you - upon completing the quest he gives you "history of the dead three" - maybe he wanted you (the protagonist) to read this book and thought that by giving you it this way he would cause less suspicion?

@LoOk
that's was the closest place to get it, if "stealing" is not your game it can be found in some otherplaces too
Title: Re: Tarnesh AI/ Various early game comments and questions
Post by: Galactygon on May 30, 2005, 03:25:18 PM
Quote
Reminds me of how they placed normal weapons of all types before encountering magic golems in ToB.

You are not the only one. :)

-Galactygon
Title: Re: Tarnesh AI/ Various early game comments and questions
Post by: Grog on May 30, 2005, 10:58:07 PM
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-Should Jaheira start the game with 0 XPs? I've had the impression that she was a more experienced adventurer than the others.
All NPCs join party at the same level as the PC. The backgrounds of some characters suggest that their minimal level should be higher than 1, though, but I think they should be kept at same level for consistency and balance.

The problem isn't that she starts at level 1, its that she starts with 0 XP (while Khalid starts with 2002 XP).